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Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 00:22:22 -0800
Subject: FW: Discrimination at Summer Hockey Camps
From: Michele Ryan 
To: Women in Hockey Mailing List 
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Recently a father on the list posted a message about his daughter's
experience with trying to attend a summer hockey camp at Miami University.

He wrote:

> "Essentially, this means that 36 to 72 girls EACH WEEK must sign up,
> depending on the programs and age groups offered. Each year, about 10-15
> girls sign up, and their money is refunded. No marketing goes into
> recruitment of female campers, coaches, or counselors. Miami thinks it has
> the perfect solution to keeping girls from attending their summer hockey
> camp." 

I'm not sure why, but this policy really bothered me, so I wrote first to
the director of the summer hockey camps, who replied that:

> we have worked closely with our Affirmative
> Action Office to insure that we are in compliance with the law.  We mass
> market, and rely primarily on word of mouth....  The comments made below by
> the mom you mention are not accurate.

Because I didn't fell that his reply adequately addressed the problem, I
then wrote to the university's Director of Affirmative Action.  He replied:

> "I had to check with Mr. Korn who directs the summer camps and the U.S.
Department of Education, Office for Civil Rights to determine if there had
been any policy changes or change in interpretation of Title IX policies and
regulations since we last reviewed our policy concerning the female and male
summer hockey camps.  USED,OCR interprets this issue as an extracurricular
activity under Section 106.31 "Education programs and activities" of Title
IX.  Therefore it is not a violation to hold separate programs for males and
females using the same enrollment criteria of 36 participants per week by
age group.  If there is a lack of participation by week by age the refund of
fees and cancellation of the camp for that group is of a nondiscriminatory
justification. 

> We have paid listings of the summer opportunities for females and males in
"American Hockey Magazine" and "Hockey News".  In addition we mail 15,000
brochures to coaches and presidents of hockey associations and to past camp
registrants. 

I have read this policy, and it doesn't seem to provide the exemption he
mentions, but perhaps this is the Department of Education's interpretation
of the policy.

Anyway, I think if anyone else is concerned about Miami University's policy,
I would urge you to contact both the director of the summer camps and the
university's affirmative action office.  The contacts are:

Mitch Korn (director of the summer camps): email@hidden

Gary L. Hunter (Director of Affirmative Action): email@hidden

If they know more people are watching them more closely, maybe they will
find a way to include both girls and boys in their camps.

--Michele

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Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 06:27:35 EST
From: email@hidden
Subject: Re: FW: Discrimination at Summer Hockey Camps
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     Then, again, with such apparent disregard for female hockey players, why would a girl even _want_ to go there, unless she happened to live in town?? There are a lot of camps out there with coaches of women's college hockey teams in charge, and female college players for counsellors. You don't have to go somewhere where they're just "going through the motions". If you can travel out of Ohio, I'd recommend the camp my daughter has attended the last two years at St. Mary's University in Winona, MN.

In a message dated Tue, 13 Mar 2001  3:28:48 AM Eastern Standard Time, Michele Ryan  writes:

<< Recently a father on the list posted a message about his daughter's
experience with trying to attend a summer hockey camp at Miami University.

He wrote:

> "Essentially, this means that 36 to 72 girls EACH WEEK must sign up,
> depending on the programs and age groups offered. Each year, about 10-15
> girls sign up, and their money is refunded. No marketing goes into
> recruitment of female campers, coaches, or counselors. Miami thinks it has
> the perfect solution to keeping girls from attending their summer hockey
> camp." 

I'm not sure why, but this policy really bothered me, so I wrote first to
the director of the summer hockey camps, who replied that:

> we have worked closely with our Affirmative
> Action Office to insure that we are in compliance with the law.  We mass
> market, and rely primarily on word of mouth....  The comments made below by
> the mom you mention are not accurate.

Because I didn't fell that his reply adequately addressed the problem, I
then wrote to the university's Director of Affirmative Action.  He replied:

> "I had to check with Mr. Korn who directs the summer camps and the U.S.
Department of Education, Office for Civil Rights to determine if there had
been any policy changes or change in interpretation of Title IX policies and
regulations since we last reviewed our policy concerning the female and male
summer hockey camps.  USED,OCR interprets this issue as an extracurricular
activity under Section 106.31 "Education programs and activities" of Title
IX.  Therefore it is not a violation to hold separate programs for males and
females using the same enrollment criteria of 36 participants per week by
age group.  If there is a lack of participation by week by age the refund of
fees and cancellation of the camp for that group is of a nondiscriminatory
justification. 

> We have paid listings of the summer opportunities for females and males in
"American Hockey Magazine" and "Hockey News".  In addition we mail 15,000
brochures to coaches and presidents of hockey associations and to past camp
registrants. 

I have read this policy, and it doesn't seem to provide the exemption he
mentions, but perhaps this is the Department of Education's interpretation
of the policy.

Anyway, I think if anyone else is concerned about Miami University's policy,
I would urge you to contact both the director of the summer camps and the
university's affirmative action office.  The contacts are:

Mitch Korn (director of the summer camps): email@hidden

Gary L. Hunter (Director of Affirmative Action): email@hidden

If they know more people are watching them more closely, maybe they will
find a way to include both girls and boys in their camps.

--Michele  >>

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From: Andria Hunter 
To: email@hidden
Subject: Sami Jo Small, World Champion Hockey Goalie will be speaking
  and modeling!
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Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 14:07:24 -0500
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I'm passing along this message that I just received...

Andria

------------

"Future is Female" is a nationwide motivational speaking and fashion
series with a team of Canada's top female athletes.  We're going to be
speaking and modeling in Ottawa March 23rd!  (next week).  If you know
of people in Ottawa who have daughters who would benefit from increased
self-esteem and positive body image, let them know about this event.

All details on our website:
  http://www.futureisfemale.com/ottawa/march23.html

call 416 966 0888 for tickets.

thanks,
Lisa Ling
Future is Female Co-founder
www.futureisfemale.com

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References: 
Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 13:50:57 -0500
To: email@hidden
From: Debbie Minden 
Subject: Re: FW: Discrimination at Summer Hockey Camps
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Last summer my daughter did a week at Bladerunner in Harmarville, PA 
at a Mitch Korn Defensmen camp.  She was the only girl.  When she 
felt the had been placed incorrectly they evaluated her again and 
then moved her up to her age level and not height level.  She said 
that that camp was the best of the three she went to all summer.  The 
other two were girl's camps.  She had a great time, learned a lot, 
and even though she was the only girl in the bantam/midget section, 
she got the MVP.

My daughter was treated fairly and we have no complaints about Mitch 
Korn.  Another family had a similar experience the year before. 
Maybe several years ago there were problems, but there are none now.

Debbie Minden

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From: email@hidden
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Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 21:07:42 EST
Subject: goalie needed for Brampton
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Hello,
We are looking for a goalie to play in the Senior Rec division in the 
Brampton Tourny on Easter weekend. We have a good team from the NYC area, and 
have loads of fun. This is are third year attending.  If you are interested, 
please send an e-mail.

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Message-ID: <002701c0ac5e$4fd77f00$email@hidden>
From: "Dan Guard" 
To: 
Subject: Reaction to Summer Camp opportunities for girls (or the lack
  thereof)
Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2001 00:11:02 -0800
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Following the information given in the latest communique regarding the U of
Miami-Ohio' lack of opportunities for girl summer hockey campers, it is very
difficult to contain both the personal and professional anger that I feel
toward the ridiculous dialog that we are receiving from these administrative
people (and belive me, that ain't the appellation that I really want to use).
Accordingly, I have written:

Say, fellas...Mitch, et al...

I write as a fellow recreation administrative professional, and one who has a
proprietary interest in hockey, and girls in hockey...I must confess that what
I have heard in our Women-in-hockey internetwork makes me downright angry:

I noted to the original writer regarding your inability to provide meaningful
opportunities for girls at your summer hockey instructional camps:

"It is the fiduciary responsibility of such administrators to actively, on
purpose, seek to find ways to provide such opportunities at the level they are
needed. In other words, gang, if only fifteen girls want to play at the camp
this week, then you put on the camp for fifteen girls, rather than using this
as an excuse for not doing your job."

On the other hand, guys, if you feel that you have no responsibility to the
public, that as a private, for profit enterprise, you cannot aford a lesser
profit margin, and that you have no moral imperative to do what is right, than
o.k...keep on holding no summer camps for girls...

Or...

have some guts, and accomplish something good...

your choice...

incidentally, if you are to reply that you cannot put on a camp without the
ridiculously restrictive minimum number of participants that has been cited to
us, would you like me to do it for you?... because I can...and I have programs
like this all the time, year round, at the facility that I operate...

If this is off-base, then you might want to explain your situation to the
readership of this internetwork.

Daniel T. Guard,
Recreation Services Supervisor,
email@hidden ,
El Paso, Texas