Parent
From: email@hidden (Women-in-Hockey Digest)
To: email@hidden
Subject: Women-in-Hockey Digest V1 #170
Reply-To: women-in-hockey
Sender: email@hidden
Errors-To: email@hidden
Precedence: bulk
Women-in-Hockey Digest Wednesday, March 4 1998 Volume 01 : Number 170
In this issue:
Canadian Women's University Hockey - National Championship Results
Re: Troubles with the Men?
Re: Re: Troubles with the Men?
Girls' High School Hockey
better fitting pants....THANKS!
Pants
Re: Troubles with the Men?
Re: better fitting pants....THANKS!
Re: Troubles with the Men?
Re: Troubles with the Men?
Re: Troubles with the Men?
Re: "Parentitis" the disease!!!
Re: Troubles with the Men?
=======================================================================
Unsubscribe:
Help:
or
=======================================================================
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Tue, 3 Mar 1998 18:06:32 -0500
From: Andria Hunter
Subject: Canadian Women's University Hockey - National Championship Results
>Round Robin Results:
> Feb 26: Guelph 2 vs UQTR 2 -- Pool A**
> Concordia 1 vs Toronto 0 -- Pool B
>
> Feb 27: UQTR 7 vs Saint Mary's 0 -- Pool A**
> Toronto 2 vs Alberta 2 -- Pool B**
> Guelph 7 vs Saint Mary's 0 -- Pool A
> Concordia 7 vs Alberta 0 -- Pool B
>
>Semi-final/Final Results:
> Feb 28: Guelph 0 vs Concordia 3 -- Semi-Final #1
> UQTR 0 vs Toronto 3 -- Semi-Final #2
> St Mary's 0 vs Alberta 5 -- 5th place final**
>
> Mar 1: Guelph 3 vs UQTR 4 -- Bronze Medal (OT)
> Concordia 4 vs Toronto 1 -- Gold Medal (EN)
Ooops, there were 4 incorrect scores in my last posting. See **
above. Sorry about that. I sent the wrong version of this file!!
The scores should be:
Round Robin : UQTR 2 Guelph 0
Concordia 1 Toronto 0
UQTR 9 St.Mary's 0
Toronto 2 Alberta 0
Guelph 7 St.Mary's 0
Concordia 7 Alberta 0
Semi Finals : Toronto 3 UQTR 0
Concordia 3 Guelph 0
5th Place Game : Alberta 10 St.Mary's 0
Bronze Medal Game : UQTR 4 Guelph 3 (OT)
Gold Medal Game : Concordia 4 Toronto 1
Andria
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 3 Mar 1998 20:02:28 EST
From: Goneskatin
Subject: Re: Troubles with the Men?
In a message dated 98-03-03 16:11:22 EST, Jackie wrote in response to previous
post about roughness:
>
>Didn't any of your male teammates come to your defence? If a male player
>EVER
>checked me TWICE as hard as he would another male player all hell would break
>loose on the ice, I guarantee it! If noone came to your defence, I would
>certainly think about looking for another team.
>
>Jackie
I concur with Jackie, but not for the same reasons. I am also curious as to
the officials assessment of penalties, if any, for these "intentional"
infractions. If the officials are aware of this player checking and are not
calling penalties to eliminate the dangerous and illegal behaviour, then you
oughta think about finding another league, not inciting a riot. Remember that
the "aggressor" falls to the lowest rung on the food chain in a court of
law....just make sure it isn't you!
Before you do that, write up the incidents and present them notarized and
return reciept requested via the U.S. postal service to the rink
owners/managers with copies to the officials and USA Hockey, if they sanction
your league play. Include the officia'ls response to the illegal behaviour, or
lack of response. No rink manager wants to have $$ tied up in lawsuits from
players injured because of rules not being enforced. Just because you signed a
waiver at the beginning of the season does not excuse the rink from liability
in enforcing safe conduct and play. Sometimes just the hint of a paper trail
starting that could lead to lawyers fees is enough to make them take action.
Another question I have about the contact is, did it occur after play was
whistled down...like a late hit, or outside of time clock play. That IS cut
and dried assault and the police have an easier time making that case if you
can prove it. And this leads into my next suggestion.
If you plan on continuing play in this league, maybe because you like the
other guys and/or just recently started a season, another remedy exists.
Consider having a friend video tape the game for review later, i.e. in a court
of law. Having the offender on tape to take to court, plus injuries sustained
would make any personal injury lawyers day!
Now....having described the non-violent path to resolution, I will share my
experience along the same lines. Our women's team played in a men's rec roller
league for one season. I can proudly report we did NOT come in last! We played
a team of men who were all aggressive skaters and there was clean contact from
all the guys except one. This dude skated way beyond his control and knocked
down 3 of our girls, including one of our better, more agile skaters. He
recieved the only "intentional" check I have EVER thrown playing ice or
roller. Skating defense, I'm 5'6" and most of my 175lbs is in my hips and
legs. When I hip checked him, this dude came up off the floor and hung on the
wall like Jordan soaring in the air, squealing to the ref all the way down. I
told him as I skated to the box, "Knock us down, you're going down, too. Skate
in control, dude!" We had no more shenanigans from HIM! The key to that
manoever is head immediately for the box ....don't hang around for
the chest thumping and cat stares the guys use to instigate a fight. If you
are going to play that physical, make your point with the contact, say "good
call, ref!" and skate off.
Terry
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 3 Mar 1998 20:49:51 EST
From: Jennej
Subject: Re: Re: Troubles with the Men?
In a message dated 3/3/98 8:26:39 PM, email@hidden wrote:
<>
Maybe guys with that attitude should wear pink jerseys - then we'd be able to
identify them. I would have told him that it would be a good color on him.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 03 Mar 1998 21:09:41 -0500
From: David Huculak
Subject: Girls' High School Hockey
Good Day:
The final league results from Sudbury Girls's High School Hockey :
School W L T GF GA PTS
Marymount College 12 0 0 86 6 24
Lo-Ellen 9 2 1 45 23 19
Notre Dame 7 3 2 25 25 16
Champlain 6 5 1 23 25 13
Lasalle 5 7 0 17 27 10
Confederation 4 7 1 17 46 9
St. Charles 2 9 1 19 40 5
Lively 0 12 0 8 48 0
Playoff Results:
Semi-final #1:
Marymount - 8 Champlain - 1
Marymount - 5 Champlain - 0
Semi-final #2:
Notre Dame - 1 Lo-Ellen - 0
Lo-Ellen - 2 Notre Dame - 1
Lo-Ellen - 3 Notre Dame - 1
Final :
Marymount - 9 Lo-Ellen - 2
Marymount - 6 Lo-Ellen - 1
Marymount completes a 31 game undefeated season by winning their
4th consecutive City Championship.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 3 Mar 1998 21:09:37 EST
From: Goneskatin
Subject: better fitting pants....THANKS!
To everyone who responded to my call for feedback on brands of pants.....a big
THANK YOU!
I will be shopping this weekend and trying to find a pair of Tacklas and
Louisville women's pants to compare. I will be paying special attention to the
coverage over the knee and lower thigh with my legs flexed. If both these
brands ride up the thigh and leave a gap I guess the next step is to e-mail
the companies that make them ,eh?
Perhaps with enough of us giving the companies feedback about what we need
that separates us from the "men and the boys" there will be a greater
selection available down the road. And what are the U.S. and Canada women's
teams wearing? You KNOW their pants got a work out! You would think Bauer,
Louisville, CCM et al would be seeking these women out for advertising
endorsements to promote their women's lines?!
Another issue with women's pants are the sizes and styles....we don't just
come in "regular" and "tall" and some of us might WANT hot pink pants! .
I hope some company is addressing the dearth of fashion in hockey I
personally would love to have pants with lightening bolts in reflective tape
on the sides of my pants....LOL My teammates would never miss another pass to
me!...
Alright ladies!....where's the fashion overhaul of hockey going to begin? New
York, Seattle, Phoenix?.....who's going to be first to "skate outside the
fashion circle"?....LOL
NOT a Dennis Rodman wannabe..........Terry
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 3 Mar 1998 20:16:39 -0600 (CST)
From: LM
Subject: Pants
Goneskatin asks:
<>
I wear a Cooper girdle. It has pads in all the right places and fits like
a glove since it's made out of lycra or something like it. At practice I
wear sweat pants over the girdle and then I don't have to mess with hockey
socks. In a game, I wear a shell over the girdle with hockey socks. I
really like these pants. I've had them for four years. Before that I
wore tacklas which like another poster, I found tight in the hips.
What is also kind of neat about them is you can get different colored
shells to wear over them. That way if you switch teams you can cheaply be
wearing the correct color pants.
Good luck, Laura
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 3 Mar 1998 17:38:19 -0900
From: Syrilyn Tong
Subject: Re: Troubles with the Men?
As a goalie, I was once just messing around after a scrimmage when a midget
aged boy (one of the midget A's, so he was VERY good with his shot
placement) and I were the only ones on the ice. I was way deep in the net
(again, just screwing around), so he had the ENTIRE net to shoot at. He
wound up from about 10 feet away and blasted a shot to the middle of my
facemask. The entire force of the puck was transferred to my mask, face
and jawbone. I couldn't hear out of my right ear for about 10 minutes, and
couldn't chew out of the right side of my mouth for 2 days. So yes, there
are some real idiots out there. Fortunately, there's only been 2 in my 15
years that I've been playing.
Syrilyn Tong
email@hidden
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 3 Mar 1998 20:34:32 -0800
From: Anne Paulson
Subject: Re: better fitting pants....THANKS!
> I will be shopping this weekend and trying to find a pair of Tacklas and
> Louisville women's pants to compare. I will be paying special attention to
the
> coverage over the knee and lower thigh with my legs flexed. If both these
> brands ride up the thigh and leave a gap I guess the next step is to e-mail
> the companies that make them ,eh?
>
> Perhaps with enough of us giving the companies feedback about what we need
> that separates us from the "men and the boys" there will be a greater
> selection available down the road.
I'm sorry if I'm being dense, but I don't quite understand how being unable
to find pants that are long enough is a women's issue. If anything, since
women are on average shorter than men, you'd think that some women might
have trouble finding pants that are short enough.
It was my impression that the new women's pants were sized to fit around
women's more curvy hips, because some women find it hard to fit both
their waists and their hips in pants designed for men's straight up and
down hips. I have not tried the women's pants myself, since my hips are
basically straight up and down, but I'm glad that other women who have
more typically female figures are liking them.
- -- Anne Paulson
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 03 Mar 1998 21:26:35 -0600
From: widget
Subject: Re: Troubles with the Men?
I agree with Terry's suggestion of starting a paper trail on this guy.
Recently there was a problem at one of our local rinks where one *renegade*
guy was roughing up the women in an adult novice league. Finally, one night,
one of the women had enough and took him to the boards and began punching him.
I hear it was pretty funny considering he is at least 6-2. He got a
cross-checking penalty and she proudly took the roughing call. The incicent
finally galvanized the women who had been silently taking the abuse and they
formally complained to the rink management. I am very happy to report that
the rink removed the offending guy from the league. I was there when he
showed up the next week, and the rink stood there ground and would not let him
skate.
I also agree with Jackie (and Terry's example) that teammates (of both sexes)
should speak up against this sort of behavior (whether the aggressor is male
or female and regardless of the sex of the victim). Acknowlegely, there are
many men who cannot watch a woman get hit by a man. I discovered a long time
ago that the worst thing I can do to a guy who takes a cheap shot at me is to
- -stay down-; the guys on my team exact a pretty good price for rouging up
women. I asked some of them if I was taking unfair advantage of them and most
of them felt it was an *ok* thing to do.
Cheers,
Lea
- --
*********
"Sometimes you have to look reality in the eye
and deny it." --- Garrison Keillor
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 3 Mar 1998 23:12:28 -0600 (CST)
From: email@hidden
Subject: Re: Troubles with the Men?
You made the comment that this man was from the "old school" Well it's not that old. When Ana
tried out once for a Midget team, the boys wanted to make sure she knew she wasn't wanted there.
On one shift, two boys sandwiched her in front of the goal after the whistle blew. After she
had deeked a defensemen on three different drills, he grabbed her by the shoulder pads and threw
her to the ice. At tryouts there is no ref and no teammates to defend you. The final blow was
a hard hit into the boards with an elbow up at her throat. As the player skated off after the
hit, Ana reached out and hooked his skate with her stick and flipped him in the air and flat on
his face. All the spectators watching saw this and laughed at the sight of him being flipped.
After that all the guys left her alone, they didn't want to be the next one embarrassed by her.
This type of treatment isn't right, but it is what women and girls have been battling with for
years. It is why Ana prefers to play with the women now. Men and boys make you earn your spot
to play with them. It's that same reason why some of the Olympians used boys names to play
under and tucked their hair up under the helmet, to avoid becoming targets from the other team's
member. Ref's can help, coaches can too, but first you have to change their mentality, because
they sometimes think the same way.
I think the Olympics have gone a long way in changing attitudes and showing that women can also
play hockey. Attitudes will change slowly and acceptance is coming, just don't expect it
overnight, and when playing with the boys...Keep you head up!
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 4 Mar 1998 01:02:51 EST
From: LuvCLemx22
Subject: Re: Troubles with the Men?
In a message dated 98-03-03 21:52:23 EST, email@hidden writes:
<< Fortunately, there's only been 2 in my 15
years that I've been playing. >>
Most of my experience has been good too, like 98% of it. Normally, the guy
that would act like that is someone who will act like an idiot with other male
players. They are just an idiot!
Jackie
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 3 Mar 1998 23:52:43 -0800
From: Chuq Von Rospach
Subject: Re: "Parentitis" the disease!!!
At 5:13 AM -0800 2/27/98, VIC'S HOCKEY SCHOOLS wrote:
> BrushScript BTVic
> LeMire
>
> Vic LeMire
Vic, one thing: PLEASE turn off the HTML formatting in your email
messages to the list. We requst everything be straight ascii text. My
system should have bounced them, but for technical reasons didn't.
That's probably fixed, so don't be surprised if you get them returned
until this is turned off... FYI.
- --
Chuq Von Rospach (Hockey fan? )
Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:email@hidden)
Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:email@hidden)
+
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 4 Mar 1998 03:05:55 EST
From: DAT BYTES
Subject: Re: Troubles with the Men?
In a message dated 98-03-03 13:29:54 EST, email@hidden writes:
<< Everyone who saw it say that he's an"old-school Ice hockey
player, one of the guys that feels that this is a men's sport, and women have
no place in hockey". I've seen him check guys before, but everyone agrees,
he
never hits the guys half as hard as he hit me.
Basically, I wanted to know has anyone else ever had a problem like this?
>>
I had trouble similar to this when I first started out last June in an
"instructional league."
My first day out opn the ice, I was (sorta) holding my own during the drills
(albeit VERY VERY shakey on my skates.) It was pretty obvious that I was a
total beginner. Then we got to the point where we had a scrimmage.
My first shift out, I got my clock cleaned by some dude who was over 6 feet
tall, and had the girth of 4 kegs of beer.
I thought that, since this was just a beginner;s clinic, he was probably as
out of contraol as I was. So, I let it pass without another thought.
Next shift out - KABOOM! Same thing. hhhmmmm..... starting to notice
something here. I also noticed that I seemed to be the only one he hit.
(There may have been 1 woman in the clinic - but I'm not sure.)
3rd shift out...... I saw him comming........ and I braced myself for his hit.
He kinda bounced off of me, with a look of stupor on his face. He didn;t
fall, but he did go back a few feet.
The following week......... 1 or 2 similar incidents.
The week after..... same thing. gggggrrrrrrrrr..... What an idiot!! What
was he trying to prove? That he could knock over a beginner woman 1/2 his
size? (nobody was impressed.. but I was getting tired of his crap.)
The week after that......... I went to the women;s clinic...... even though
it was meant for players with a bit more experience, I got a lot mrer out of
it.. and certainly did not have to take that S---.
And.......... they were a lot mroe fun to play with. They were all very
supportive of each other. And they would shout bits of encouragement! WOW!!
THIS was a LOT more fun!! :-)
===========
When I got more experience. I went to open hockey quite a bit. There were
times where I was the only woman on the ice. I got more confident on my
skates, I am a pretty good size, and I can "hold my own" when someone "rides
me off the puck."
They see that I can take a hit, but I can also give one when necessary (If I
can catch them!!) Usuallly I have found that once I take the first hit, (and
they bounce off of me) they tend to back off after that.
There was one time when the one of the guys was whining about something. One
of the other guys was furious with him. At the end, he was swearing at the
whiney dude (for whatever stuopid reason) and then pointed to me and said
"she;s a GIRL and I haven't heard a peep out of her!!" Then he smiled &
winked at me. I guess that was a compliment of sorts.
The only other problem I have had with the men is during open hockey. 1) they
smell bad, 2) they drink from my water bottle without asking (like how long
have they been playing - they can;t figure out to bring their own friggin
water bottle???) 3) They do not seem to know the meaning of the words "SHIFT
CHANGE!!"
When my friends rent the ice privately & play pick-up hockey it is usually
almost all guys (maybe 3 or 4 women.) These guys make it their business to
find out the skill level of each player (esp the women) and play them
accordingly. Whe I was first starting out, they would play me just enough
(and occassionaly bump me lightly - ALWAYS while smiling) to make it somewhat
of a challenge for me. They also made sure to pass the puck to me & give me a
chance to skate with the puck before they would steal it from me. Just shows
ya, that all hockey playing men are not evil!! In fact, some are pretty nice
guys!!! =D
Well, I think I just cured my insomnia. Sorry for rambling on.
Jill
# 77 Brooklyn Blades
"Only you can prevent hockey stick fires."
------------------------------
End of Women-in-Hockey Digest V1 #170
*************************************