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Subject: Women-in-Hockey Digest V1 #84
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Women-in-Hockey Digest Friday, December 19 1997 Volume 01 : Number 084
In this issue:
Miscellaneous
[none]
Rheaume "scandal"??
Re: Officials Review vet's release from Olympic Team
Re: Incidental contact
Re: Rheaume "scandal"??
Officials Review vet's release from Olympic Team
t-shirts
Angela James
Wrong
More miscellaneous
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Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 19:48:06 EST
From: Kittencat3
Subject: Miscellaneous
The thing that impressed me the most was the sheer speed of it - they looked
comparable to a Division III men's hockey team, or maybe even the United
League. The passing was also very good, and it was nice to see good, clean,
spirited play. Karen Bye looked very good, and Therese Brisson seemed to have
a good game for Canada.
When it comes to the goalies, I think Whitten's played her way out of a job.
I know she has experience, and I've always liked her, but she gave up two bad
goalies last night (including the game winner), seemed to have trouble with
the five hole, and generally didn't look too sharp. And going with a goalie
who has a save percentage in the 880's over two goalies with SP's in the 900's
just doesn't make sense. I really thought Whitten would be the star for the
United States, but at this point I cannot see Ben Smith justifying cutting
DaCosta or Tueting in favor of Whitten. It's funny - Whitten made a couple of
spectacular saves, and then gave up some soft goals. Very inconsistent, and a
luxury the US can't afford if they want the gold.
Rheaume, on the other hand, looked good. I'd never seen her play before, and
she has a nice, clean, smooth style. Her defense left her out to dry on most
of those goals, and she made some *very* good saves. I was impressed.
As for the Angela James business - if it turns out that she was turfed in a
political move, then Canadian Hockey should also investigate Manon Rheaume
being turfed this spring. The fact that Rheaume, who was supposedly washed up
and out of shape, is now Canada's #1 less than a year later, makes me very
suspicious about last spring. If politics is taking precedence over play,
Canadian Hockey should stop it *now* so the team has a chance to recover
before the Games.
...and so it goes....
Lisa Evans
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Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 21:56:42, -0500
From: email@hidden (MISS CAROLYN R SIMON)
Subject: [none]
<>
It's not as if I have a hockey terms dictionary in front of me, but
this phrase is incorrect. You can definitely use body contact to
nudge a player off the puck. What the no body-checking rule is trying
to prevent is the massive open-ice hits, the charging, the raised
elbows, etc., that we see in men's hockey.
-Carolyn
NJ Selects
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Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 22:00:39, -0500
From: email@hidden (MISS CAROLYN R SIMON)
Subject: Rheaume "scandal"??
<>
You are quite misinformed. Manon Rheaume was cut from the women's
national team this past year due to the fact that she was giving
birth to a child. That's far from being "turfed" from the team. As
far as her being the number one goalie, not that it's my decision,
but I don't really think she belongs there.
-Carolyn #21
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Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 23:02:48 EST
From: RG Traynor
Subject: Re: Officials Review vet's release from Olympic Team
<< How many players of James stature were cut from the team? None. Has
anyone on this list who has watched Angela James play honestly say they
weren't shocked when they heard she was cut. I doubt it.>>
How many on this list have ever SEEN Angela James play, how many within the
last year, and how many more than once or twice (Larry Bird's second to last
game, he was the great All-Star he had been. Otherwise, a broken up aging
vet)? Certainly none of us have as often as the Olympic team coaches, who
might have a decent handle on how the candidates were playing. That aside,
the quoted comments were pretty straightforward - Canada isn't picking players
on what they did or were five years ago. Moreover, given how evenly matched
the Canadian and American teams are, how many better skaters do you feel
comfortable with bouncing in favor of aging legends? You certainly don't see
the men's team with Ed Belfour, Dale Hawerchuk, John MacLean, Mike Gartner,
Luc Robitaille, or a few other guys who a half dozen years ago would have been
mortal locks.
And if James *really* was done in over a screwjob, with the first ever women's
gold on the line, knowing there'd be flak, for what reason would the coaches
risk it?
- - Bevan
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Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 23:50:38 EST
From: LuvCLemx22
Subject: Re: Incidental contact
In a message dated 97-12-18 12:54:52 EST, email@hidden
writes:
<< On Thu, 18 Dec 1997, DAVE BAKER wrote:
>
> What are the calling it then? Body contact and body checking are two
> different things. A body check is used to seperate the player from
> the puck. Body contact is the result of two players moving in the
> same direction to gain possession of the puck.
> >>
As a USA Certified Coach, I have the same definition in my handbook. So once
again, I ask the question, - "Why don't they call it what it is?" or am I the
only one that saw players being seperate from the puck by a body check?
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 19 Dec 1997 01:24:32 EST
From: Pergish1
Subject: Re: Rheaume "scandal"??
In a message dated 97-12-19 00:02:13 EST, email@hidden writes:
<<
You are quite misinformed. Manon Rheaume was cut from the women's
national team this past year due to the fact that she was giving
birth to a child. That's far from being "turfed" from the team. As
far as her being the number one goalie, not that it's my decision,
but I don't really think she belongs there.
-Carolyn #21
>>
Beg pardon? That's the first I've heard she had a baby and, as far as I know,
is wrong. She was quite upset to have been cut from the team. What's your
source?
Margaret
Brooklyn Blades, #49
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 19 Dec 1997 02:18:06 -0500 (EST)
From: Greg GMSMITH Marlene Smith
Subject: Officials Review vet's release from Olympic Team
>How many on this list have ever SEEN Angela James play, how many within
the
Probably more than you would think..
>vet)? Certainly none of us have as often as the Olympic team coaches,
who
>might have a decent handle on how the candidates were playing. That
aside,
That doesn't preclude us from questioning and debating the decisions of
the coaching staff. Make no mistake, A.J. can still play the game and
play it well. 11 points in 13 games in limited ice time isn't too shabby,
particularly without power play time where A.J. is at her best.
>the quoted comments were pretty straightforward - Canada isn't picking
players
>on what they did or were five years ago. Moreover, given how evenly
matched
And I'm not saying they should. If you read closely, my comments were in
response to your open query as to why there was a formal investigation
into Angela James being cut. I simply explained that it was the least CHA
could do in return for what James has done in the past.
That being said, are you saying that what James has done in the past is
irrelvant? A.J. can still play and even if she was considered by the
coaching staff to be "on the bubble" (which is totally ridiculous.. but
whatever), certainly her past experience, and her demonstrated ability to
play and deliver in pressure situations should have counted for something.
Instead we get this really lame excuse about how she's a "defensive
liability". What a cop-out, I can't believe anybody would buy that
excuse..
>the Canadian and American teams are, how many better skaters do you feel
>comfortable with bouncing in favor of aging legends? You certainly don't
see
You can't honestly sit here and tell me that there are 20 players in
Canada who are better than Angela James.
>the men's team with Ed Belfour, Dale Hawerchuk, John MacLean, Mike
Gartner,
>Luc Robitaille, or a few other guys who a half dozen years ago would have
been
>mortal locks.
Hmm... well you do see that the men's team has veteran players such as
Wayne Gretzky, Ray Bourque, Al MacInnis, and Scott Stevens... now don't
you?
>And if James *really* was done in over a screwjob, with the first ever
women's
>gold on the line, knowing there'd be flak, for what reason would the
coaches
>risk it?
If you had followed the past history of the team, and Shannon Miller's
track record, you'd know exactly why she did it. Clearly, she did not
anticipate the furor her decision has caused and it has turned around and
back-fired on her. It remains to be seen whether it will cost her team
the 3-Nations Cup and the Gold Medal in Nagano. That would certainly kill
that "momentum" that Miller loves to rant about in a hurry.
Greg.
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 19 Dec 1997 09:17:56 -0600
From: "Dorene Peifer"
Subject: t-shirts
I have t-shirts for sale that Cammi's Mother spoke of on the Lifetime interview. The Minnesota Girls' & Women's Hockey Association bought 6 boxes of them to sell at tournaments with the profits going to the Minnesota parents who make the Olympic team. If you are interested in one....e-mail me DIRECTLY on TUESDAY. By then I should know how much the mailing would cost - the shirts are $15 and can take orders after TUESDAY. They only come in two sizes XLarge and Medium. E-mail: email@hidden
Dorene Peifer
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 19 Dec 1997 13:42:01 EST
From: CoCre8tor
Subject: Angela James
I need information on Angela James of the Canadian National Team. Stats,
career highlights, biographical, etc. It is for an article I am writing on
African-American hockey players - male & female. If you know of a web-site or
have access to this info, please email me. I'm also interested in any
African-American Team USA players.
Thanks in advance and Happy Holidays!
Mike
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 19 Dec 1997 19:19:26 EST
From: Kittencat3
Subject: Wrong
Completely, utterly wrong. Not only was Manon Rheaume not pregnant last
spring, she was the #1 goalie for Reno in the Western Hockey League both
before AND after the Worlds. There isn't a team in hockey that would play a
pregnant woman - my God, professional *basketball* teams make pregnant players
(like Sheryl Swoopes and Nikki McCray) sit out the season, and if a
comparatively mild sport like basketball does this, the idea of a hockey team
allowing pregnant goalies is right up there with the quaint notion of a
geocentric universe.
Ludicrous, just ludicrous. I really wish to God people would bother to fact
check before posting.
Lisa Evans
Easthampton, MA
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 19 Dec 1997 19:36:52 EST
From: Kittencat3
Subject: More miscellaneous
Greg - I completely disagree about Rheaume. She looked fine to me. The
defense left her high and dry a couple of times, which resulted in goals that
just about any goalie (except maybe the likes of Patrick Roy/John
Vanbiesbrouck) would have let in. Also, when the game was on the line in the
third period, Rheaume did her job, which is more than you can say for Whitten.
Statistically, Rheaume led Team Canada throughout the exhibition season,
followed by Lesley Reddon, Danielle Dube, and converted track athlete Sami Jo
Small. If the stats are wrong, and they should have gone with Small and Dube,
pray tell what criteria should have been used if goals against and save
percentage are inaccurate?
As for Bevan's comments about Angela James - I wouldn't be shocked to learn
that politics had more to do with her being cut than ability (not to mention
race, which hasn't come up so far - am I mistaken, or was she the only black
player on the team?). However, his point about aging stars not necessarily
making the Olympics based on past service is quite valid. Yes, Ray Bourque
and several other old warhorses are on Team Canada this year, but if the
selection had been made *last* year, when Bourque looked worn out and the
Bruins were playing badly, he wouldn't have been selected. Same with Gretzky.
By the same token, last year Mark Messier would have the captain of the team,
and Rob Zamuner would be an obscure forward on a mediocre team, based on their
then current level of play.
One thing I guarantee: after what I saw Wednesday, we'll *know* politics is
at work with Team USA if Erin Whitten makes the final cut. She's experienced
and has a terrific resume, but she has no business in Nagano if she's playing
the way she played two nights ago.
Also - I know I posted this already, but the "Manon Rheaume was cut because
she was pregnant" rumor is utterly false. At the time when she was supposedly
ready to give birth, she was actually the #1 goalie for the Reno Renegades
out in California. For the rumor to be true, we'd be expected to believe that
a professional hockey coach would play a pregnant woman, and I somehow just
can't bring myself to do so.....
Lisa Evans
Easthampton, MA
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End of Women-in-Hockey Digest V1 #84
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