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Subject: Women-in-Hockey Digest V1 #444
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Women-in-Hockey Digest Monday, June 14 1999 Volume 01 : Number 444
In this issue:
From the Canoe Site
Women's "Sports and Fitness" magazine
Re: From the Canoe Site
Re: From the Canoe Site
I want to meet Cammi
Re: From the Canoe Site
Re: From the Canoe Site
Re: From the Canoe Web Site
Re: Women's "Sports and Fitness" magazine
Must Olympic Gold be cash
Tournament Listings Updated
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Date: Sat, 12 Jun 1999 23:51:23 -0700
From: "Phil & Debbie Cottrell"
Subject: From the Canoe Site
Women's hockey league to rival WNBA not in NHL's plans
BUFFALO, N.Y. (AP) -- Cammi Granato and Sarah Tueting and their teammates
had their gold medals, their Wheaties box cover, their guest spots on the
David Letterman show.
Only one thing was missing after they returned home to the United States
last year after winning the Olympic women's ice hockey championship.
A job.
Most returned to college or to high school, their amateur teams and the
lives they had before Nagano.
But unlike the U.S. Olympic women's basketball team, many of whom moved on
to enticing pro careers following the 1996 Olympics in Atlanta, there was no
lucrative paycheck awaiting them, no chance to cash in on their years of
trudging to 6 a.m. practices and making tortuously long bus rides to games.
All they had was a hope that, someday, there might be a women's pro hockey
league in the United States and Canada like the WNBA. Or that they, too,
might get a chance to play in men's hockey, as goaltender Manon Rheaume did
in the minors.
"I'd love play hockey and make a living at it. I support a women's
league -- 100 percent," Granato said last year. "It would give little girls
another set of role models."
According to NHL commissioner Gary Bettman, that day likely won't come
soon.
With the NHL struggling to generate TV ratings and steady some of its
financially unstable franchises, the league itself is fighting to keep its
niche among the four major pro sports.
In the league's first two seasons, WNBA games on NBC had higher ratings
than the NHL on Fox, even though TV audiences generally are much smaller in
summer, when the WNBA plays.
Game 1 of the Stanley Cup finals Tuesday night on Fox drew an audience of
only 3.7 percent of all homes in the United States with television sets,
about half the rating for Monday night pro wrestling.
As it tries to maintain its relatively small but intensely loyal base of
followers and expand its audience to younger fans who might be more inclined
to watch the X Games on ESPN, there's no room in the NHL's world right now
for a women's league.
A league might be created only when a deep-pockets investor, such as a
cable TV sports venture searching for programming, decides to take advantage
of NHL rinks that sit mostly empty during the summertime.
"I think we have enough on our plate right now making sure than NHL hockey
is as strong as it can be before we start leapfrogging into other things,"
Bettman said. "While they may be important, I don't want to lose sight of
the primary objective, and that is building our game."
Also, women's basketball has a built-in edge over women's hockey because
millions of school-age girls play the sport either competitively or for fun.
Few girls have the chance to play hockey recreationally because most hockey
rinks are booked solid for practices and games.
There are women's leagues in hockey-hungry Canada, but they have attracted
mostly regional audiences.
"I am a believer in women's hockey, a believer in women's sports in
general, but in terms of women's hockey having a future, I think that is
long term in nature," Bettman said. "If there is, we would like to be
involved with it."
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 13 Jun 1999 07:14:26 -0500 (CDT)
From: LM
Subject: Women's "Sports and Fitness" magazine
Liz Aguina wrote:
<>
This magazine has been one of the worst subscription mistakes I've ever
made. I've come to realize that if I want to read about women's fitness,
this is not the material I look to.
Laura Moss
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 13 Jun 1999 09:08:41 -0400
From: Gary Goldberg MD
Subject: Re: From the Canoe Site
>Women's hockey league to rival WNBA not in NHL's plans
>
> BUFFALO, N.Y. (AP) -- Cammi Granato and Sarah Tueting and their teammates
>had their gold medals, their Wheaties box cover, their guest spots on the
>David Letterman show.
> Only one thing was missing after they returned home to the United States
>last year after winning the Olympic women's ice hockey championship.
>
> A job.
The original modern Olympic vision was for amateur athletes of all
countries to get together to share their love of the sport. It is only
recently that a gold medal brought along jobs with big paychecks. I
can't say that I feel bad about the fact that the pay-off was "only"
personal pride and 15 minutes. Somehow, it seems a lot more honest than
the rewards of Tara Lipinski etc. Also, most of the athletes get the
same reward as the women hockey players. I once saw a list of what the
"amateurs" made, and the large majority got nothing beyond support to
train and live. The paychecks help create a situation that turns the
Olympics into big business and allow the corruption like the Salt Lake
City scandal, and recogniton for things like beach volley ball and ball
room dancing.
Not every effort has to be turned into money. Tenley Albright became a
surgeon, Debi Thomas a doctor, Mark Spitz a dentist, Eric Heyden a
doctor. Other Olympians are in law enforcement, teaching, private
businesses. Some remain in the sports field and foster other comers.
My daughter and her friends think there is no higher calling than to be
like Cammi, Sara, Sarah, and Caren. These women may not have money, but
they have the undying gratitude from parents like me for being someone
better to emmulate than Madonna and Marilyn Manson.
Debbie Minden
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1998 09:32:28 -0400
From: "TeePee Communications"
Subject: Re: From the Canoe Site
If a Women's hockey pro league would ever start, it would only survive WITHOUT someone like
Gary Bettman. Why do you think the NHL is constantly complaining about not havig enough
viewers and making less money ?
Too many teams, too little talent, too much emphasis on money.
Now more teams coming in the next two years.
Less emphasis on enjoying and promoting the enjoyment of the sport.
Look at television blackouts, TV timeouts, the emphasis on more goals. Why do we need more
goals, a pefect example is the Buffalo / Dallas Stanley Cup final.
Thats exciting, and so far fairly low scoring games.
Sitting around for 5 minutes waiting to know if a players skate lace was in the crease during a
goal is not the way to win fans.
Having players sell autographs doesnt work. How many teams got new arenas, new jerseys and
new gimmicks , just for marketing money ?
it's already happening with womens hockey.
Remember one of the hockey card companies wanted to have a womens selection ?
The deals couldn't be worked out because some players and their agents wanted too much too
soon. It is becoming very apparent at the national team level that money and big business,
instead of promoting the game, is taking over.
Now it is expected if you go to the Olympics, you'll have a great , money making career
afterwards. Tell that the ABL. Thats not the idea of the olympics. But money is taking over there
too unfortunately. All the bribes that went on for SLC, AND then they get to keep the 2002
games. Commit a crime, reap the rewards, is this todays society ? Take the games away.
getting back to women's hockey, obviously the sport would not survive without money, and the
players can't survive without money, but lets be realistic about things, and be realistic about
payouts, salaries and the enjoyment of the sport. The sport doesn't exist so people can be
become rich, the sport exists because people love to play and watch.
Tim
- ------------------------------------------
TeePee Communications
Womens Hockey Photo Website
http://web.idirect.com/~teepee/hockey.htm
- ------------------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 13 Jun 1999 10:16:19 -0400
From: "Daun DeFrance"
Subject: I want to meet Cammi
Women's SI not insulting??
I admit it is a tad better than WS&F, which is just this side of obscene.
But I was really put off by SI's treatment of the female hockey players in
their first issue. I don't have it with me, but I recall a full page where
they talked about the Gold medal winning team and the individuals notable
accomplishments. The info was pretty scarce, just a line or two about each
woman. One woman's highlights: She got to meet Michael Jordan. Um... what
about making the women's national team? Or what about her other amazing
achievements in hockey? Or her dedication to getting girls into the sports?
Wow, maybe one day I can win a gold medal and get to meet Michael Jordan,
too.
In the second issue of SI, they redeemed themselves. A teenage girl wrote
an editorial asking why there were cigarette ads in the magazine. SI's
editor responded that there would no longer be adds from cigarette companies
in Women's SI. Way to go!
That's just my take on it. The problem is that the market is just figuring
out what great consumers women are... (you know, now that we're out of the
kitchen and making a different kind of dough) and they want to make a buck.
Keep safe,
Daun
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 13 Jun 1999 08:28:41 -0700
From: Chuq Von Rospach
Subject: Re: From the Canoe Site
> BUFFALO, N.Y. (AP) -- Cammi Granato and Sarah Tueting and their teammates
> had their gold medals, their Wheaties box cover, their guest spots on the
> David Letterman show.
Just a reminder to the list. Do not post copyrighted material to the
mailing lists. It's against list rules, and it's illegal. Post the
URL so people can go view the item, but do not post the item itself,
unless the site it's on EXPLICITLY says you can.
- --
Chuq Von Rospach (Hockey fan? )
Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:email@hidden)
Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:email@hidden)
+
Snakes and trees aren't natural enemies -- but if the tree attacks first...
(Ranger Gord, The Red Green Show)
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 13 Jun 1999 08:33:26 -0700
From: Chuq Von Rospach
Subject: Re: From the Canoe Site
At 9:08 AM -0400 6/13/99, Gary Goldberg MD wrote:
> The original modern Olympic vision was for amateur athletes of all
> countries to get together to share their love of the sport.
the original, classic olympic athletes were pros, however. A good
argument can me made that this modern "amateur" version of the
olympics was actually a modern modification, and frankly, IMHO, it
was nothing more than a good-intentioned piece of idealistic
wrong-think by a couple of people.
> My daughter and her friends think there is no higher calling than to be
> like Cammi, Sara, Sarah, and Caren.
That's nice. But Cammi, Sara and everyone else actually have to eat,
pay rent, and everything else just like the rest of us. I have
nothing but respect for athletes who actually DO put their own lives
on hold for amateur athletics, but someone still has to pay the
bills. Usually, it's a parent or a spouse. Should the foundation of
athletics be on the willingness of partners to sacrifice? Or should
there be a stronger, more widely-based, foundation?
- --
Chuq Von Rospach (Hockey fan? )
Apple Mail List Gnome (mailto:email@hidden)
Plaidworks Consulting (mailto:email@hidden)
+
Snakes and trees aren't natural enemies -- but if the tree attacks first...
(Ranger Gord, The Red Green Show)
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 13 Jun 1999 15:00:42 -0400
From: Gary Goldberg MD
Subject: Re: From the Canoe Web Site
>That's nice. But Cammi, Sara and everyone else actually have to eat,
>pay rent, and everything else just like the rest of us. I have
>nothing but respect for athletes who actually DO put their own lives
>on hold for amateur athletics, but someone still has to pay the
>bills. Usually, it's a parent or a spouse. Should the foundation of
>athletics be on the willingness of partners to sacrifice? Or should
>there be a stronger, more widely-based, foundation?
I suppose it would be nice if there was a "more widely-based foundation"
so that no one would ever have to make a sacrifice. However, education,
sports, theatre, music, all come with a price. There are those
wonderful people and organizations who can sponsor budding athletes,
musicians, etc., but more often than not, those with dreams and visions
go it alone, at least on the financial end. I guess if you go into
something like sports or arts, you have to know there are no
guarantees. It's not like getting a job with a major corporation and
just waiting for the yearly raise. It would be simplistic to say that
the sacrifice makes the game all the sweeter, but in some ways, maybe it
does. After all, you have got to get something out of it beyond the bruises.
Debbie
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 13 Jun 1999 15:34:00 -0400
From: "Ron Goldey"
Subject: Re: Women's "Sports and Fitness" magazine
Hi Elizabeth,
My 2 cents:
I'm 45, male, and probably have no business in a list serve for women's
hockey, except that my daughter plays, and I really enjoy hockey.
My wife's in extremely good shape. She works out regularily,
and she enjoys an occasional drink. I play hockey twice a week, I also enjoy
a drink, and every so often, I smoke a cigar. I realize that these things
aren't necessarily good for me, but I don't drink excessively, and I maybe
smoke one cigar per month. I believe moderation is the key issue here, not
the advertisement.
I have several friends who drink excessively. I also have a friend who
exercises excessively. She's a wreck. In some ways, she's in worse physical
shape than the drinkers. My point here is I'd be more concerned if there
were an advertisement for some rapid-weight-loss program or pill on the back
of the
magazine.
btw, I'm not condoning the magazine, I think it's a piece of garbage.
======================
Ron Goldey
Healthcare IT, Inc.
Box 67
Oxford, OH 45056
email@hidden
http://www.healthcareit.com
(800) 616-2104 (v)
(513) 523-5600 (f)
======================
- ----- Original Message -----
From: Elizabeth Aguina
To:
Sent: Friday, June 11, 1999 10:51 AM
Subject: Women's "Sports and Fitness" magazine
I know we've covered this topic before, but I have to express my
outrage [snip]
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 13 Jun 1999 22:47:19 -0400
From: Gary Goldberg MD
Subject: Must Olympic Gold be cash
>>That's nice. But Cammi, Sara and everyone else actually have to eat,
>>pay rent, and everything else just like the rest of us. I have
>>nothing but respect for athletes who actually DO put their own lives
>>on hold for amateur athletics, but someone still has to pay the
>>bills. Usually, it's a parent or a spouse. Should the foundation of
>>athletics be on the willingness of partners to sacrifice? Or should
>>there be a stronger, more widely-based, foundation?
Does it really have to be a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow? Must
there be an inevitable 'cashing in'? Is Jim Thorpe less of an athletic
legend because he died penniless? Whatever happened to the honor and the
glory?
I think it is incredible how the mass media has distorted the expectation
and general understanding of what the 'typical' athlete and 'typical'
person in the entertainment business actually generate for themselves.
Before the mass media and the construction of hypersold icons and
superheroes, athletes and entertainers were not found in the upper echelons
of the socioeconomic scale. Even today, the vast majority of actors and
actresses are either dependent on others or their 'day job' to make ends
meet. Most athletic teams that do not have a mass media contract of one
type or another maintain athletes that are, at best, 'semi-pro': men and
women who play because they love their sport and what it gives them and who
must otherwise scrape to make ends meet, loan money from friends and family
hoping and praying for the break that will allow them to show their stuff
in 'the majors'. Or they use their athletic prowess to procure a college
education that will open many doors for them that would otherwise have
remained shut. So many outstanding American Olympic athletes have gone on
to distinguished professional careers, as Debbie has pointed out, and make
a decent living. Others have taken positions as coaches and assistant
coaches on college teams and stayed with their sport in another capacity.
Would they have been able to get so far in life without having taken the
Olympic pathway? Possibly, but probably not.
Would it be better if we, as a society, provided broad-based support to the
development of national elite-level athletes? It has happened before--in
East Germany, Communist Russia, China, etc. Is that what we want in this
country? Do we want to create state-supported athletics that put massive
amounts of pressure to compete successfully on the chosen few? Do we take
young children with athletic aptitude away from their families in order to
develop them under state-directed programs or do we allow the individual to
pursue their personal dreams even if (and as it often must!) entail
significant personal sacrifice, for the individual and those who love them?
Should an athlete be treated any differently from a person who chooses to
pursue an academic career and reach to their highest levels of achievement?
- --GG
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 14 Jun 1999 19:37:06 -0400
From: Andria Hunter
Subject: Tournament Listings Updated
Hi there,
I just wanted to let you know that I have updated the women's hockey
tournament submission form on my web pages so that it now contains the
month of the tournament on the main index for each country. When you
submit information about your tournament, you will now need to submit
the month in which the tournament takes places.
I think this makes it easier for users to spot a tournament that they
would like to take part in, because they are probably only interested
in competing during certain months.
For Ice Hockey Tournaments:
http://www.whockey.com/tourney/
For Ice Hockey Schools/Camps:
http://www.whockey.com/school/
For InLine Hockey Tournaments:
http://www.whockey.com/inline/tourney/
For InLine Hockey Schools/Camps:
http://www.whockey.com/inline/school/
Andria
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End of Women-in-Hockey Digest V1 #444
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