Parent
WOMEN-IN-HOCKEY Digest 591
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: Visors
by email@hidden
2) Re: Girls playing down in age
by email@hidden
3) Re: Help In Changing Girls Ages On Coed Teams -Reply
by "Joanna L. Avery"
4) Re[2]: Help In Changing Girls Ages On Coed Teams
by Jan de Regt
5) Re: Girls playing down in age
by Chuck Collins
6) Re: Re[2]: WOMEN-IN-HOCKEY digest 575
by Maura Grogan
7) Title IX charges
by "HARRIS, zharris"
8) Re: WOMEN-IN-HOCKEY digest 589
by email@hidden
9) Re: Girls playing down in age.
by email@hidden
10) Re: WOMEN-IN-HOCKEY digest 575
by email@hidden
11) Re[2]: Help In Changing Girls Ages On Coed Teams
by Tina JW Danzig
12) Re: Help in Changing Girls Ages....
by email@hidden
13) Re: Help in Changing Girls Ages....
by "Lynn Witkowski"
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Tue, 3 Jun 1997 14:26:02 -0400 (EDT)
From: email@hidden
To: email@hidden
Subject: Re: Visors
Message-ID:
In a message dated 97-06-03 11:04:04 EDT, you write:
<<
On the lighter side, I asked a friend who works for one of the NHL teams
what the pros did, and he said they were too vain to wear their glasses in
public.
>>
Al Arbour would roll in his grave, except he's alive.
I used to wear my (wire rim) glasses under my plastic mask AND my old cage
shield and still do if I'm too lazy to poke myself in the eye for 10 min to
get contacts in. The clear shampoo trick works for them, too.
One thought -- for real! -- see if you can find an unscented shampoo. I use
Body Shop's clear body soap (for my real body too, I'm not paying that much
for my face mask by itself). Comes in small bottles and you don't die from
the smell of lilies all game long.
Margaret
Blades
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 03 Jun 97 11:47:36 -0800
From: email@hidden
To:
Subject: Re: Girls playing down in age
Message-ID:
USA Hockey allows one exception to the age rule in ice hockey. A
girl is allowed to spend one year longer at Bantam level (i.e 15
years old) before going on to Midget level. This is to
compensate for the difference in size at that age between teenage
boys and girls. This is the ONLY allowance and playing down is
not allowed at any other level in coed (boys) teams.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 03 Jun 1997 14:49:34 -0400
From: "Joanna L. Avery"
To: email@hidden
Subject: Re: Help In Changing Girls Ages On Coed Teams -Reply
Message-ID:
Wouldn't you have to play girls high school hockey if it were available at
your school? I know that many MN high schools have girls' teams.
>>> 06/03/97 01:51pm >>>
NARCH and KOHO are roller hockey teams....that has nothing to do with
Ice
hockey ages.
BTW, I just thought I would share my story with everyone. I have been
playing
hovkey for 6 years now. (I'm 17) When I 1st began I was the only girl
playing
around my hometown for at least 3 years. I also started out as a right
wing,
and I was playing at my age level, and I was fine.....a few bumps and
bruises
here and there, but that can be expected with a sport like hockey. In the
end
I decided to become a goalie. I find that girls who can compete at their
age
level with the boys in the ned will become the better players. I am moving
to
MN this summer from CA to play boys varsity high school hockey...to me
girl's
hockey is just so slow. Any ways, I just thought I would add my
thoughts!
Everyone have a great day!
Kellie Severson # 30
Monticello HS
------------------------------
Date: 03 Jun 1997 15:20:21 -0400
From: Jan de Regt
To: email@hidden (Return requested),
Subject: Re[2]: Help In Changing Girls Ages On Coed Teams
I think that you may find the girl's hockey available in MN is not
"just so slow."
Jan.
______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________
Subject: Re: Help In Changing Girls Ages On Coed Teams
Author: email@hidden at Internet
Date: 6/3/97 2:05 PM
NARCH and KOHO are roller hockey teams....that has nothing to do with Ice
hockey ages.
BTW, I just thought I would share my story with everyone. I have been playing
hovkey for 6 years now. (I'm 17) When I 1st began I was the only girl playing
around my hometown for at least 3 years. I also started out as a right wing,
and I was playing at my age level, and I was fine.....a few bumps and bruises
here and there, but that can be expected with a sport like hockey. In the end
I decided to become a goalie. I find that girls who can compete at their age
level with the boys in the ned will become the better players. I am moving to
MN this summer from CA to play boys varsity high school hockey...to me girl's
hockey is just so slow. Any ways, I just thought I would add my thoughts!
Everyone have a great day!
Kellie Severson # 30
Monticello HS
------------------------------
Date: 03 Jun 97 12:54:23 PDT (Tue)
From: Chuck Collins
To: email@hidden
Subject: Re: Girls playing down in age
Message-ID:
email@hidden wrote:
> USA Hockey allows one exception to the age rule in ice hockey. A
> girl is allowed to spend one year longer at Bantam level (i.e 15
> years old) before going on to Midget level. This is to
> compensate for the difference in size at that age between teenage
> boys and girls. This is the ONLY allowance and playing down is
> not allowed at any other level in coed (boys) teams.
I've looked into this, and I believe that this was only allowed in the
state of California, and this year they stopped doing it under pressure
from the insurance people.
If anyone knows I'm wrong, please let me know.
- Chuck Collins
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 3 Jun 1997 14:16:44 -0700 (PDT)
From: Maura Grogan
To: email@hidden
Subject: Re: Re[2]: WOMEN-IN-HOCKEY digest 575
Message-ID:
I think I have a copy of the article. I'll look at home and if I do I'll
post a message tomorrow.
Maura.
At 10:45 AM 6/3/97 -0700, you wrote:
>
>
> I got it off the NYTimes web page the day after it appeared. I can't
> read the date on my printed copy (it prints reduced) but it was early
> April.
>
> You might try their web site to see if you can go that far back;
> being a large newspaper, I would think they would have archives you
> can access!
>
> Jan.
>
>
>______________________________ Reply Separator
_________________________________
>Subject: Re: WOMEN-IN-HOCKEY digest 575
>Author: email@hidden at Internet
>Date: 6/2/97 6:29 PM
>
>
>Does anyone have a copy of the NYTimes article that appeared this past
>spring about women and ice hockey? I have been looking for it for some
>time. It was a front page article.
>
>Thanks
>
>Jil
>
>Jil Nelson Kaplan
>email@hidden
>
>"Some people are always grumbling because roses have thorns.
> I am thankful thorns have roses."
>
>-- Alphonse Karr (1808 - 90) Fr. journalist and novelist
>
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 3 Jun 97 15:46:00 -0700
From: "HARRIS, zharris"
To: email@hidden
Subject: Title IX charges
Message-ID:
FYI - for those who are trying to get women's ice hockey a Varsity sport:
NEWS FOR TUESDAY, JUNE 3, 1997 -
Exerpt from Chronicle of Higher Learning
Title IX Complaint Charges 25 Colleges
With Shortchanging Women's Sports
By JIM NAUGHTON and MARK FIORE
A women's-advocacy group opened a new front in the struggle
over gender equity in intercollegiate athletics Monday. The
National Women's Law Center filed a complaint with the U.S.
Department of Education alleging that 25 colleges had violated
federal law by awarding female athletes less sports-related aid
than their male counterparts.
The law center charged that female athletes received at least
$1,000 less per person than male athletes at each of the 25
institutions named in the complaint to the department's Office
for Civil Rights.
The institutions cited were Bethune-Cookman, Boston, Coppin
State, and Wofford Colleges; Boston, Bowling Green State,
Brigham Young, Colorado State, Duke, Hampton, Liberty,
Northeastern, South Carolina State, Utah State, Vanderbilt, and
Wake Forest Universities; the College of William and Mary; $1,000 less
per person than male athletes at each of the 25
institutions named in the complaint to the department's Office
for Civil Rights.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 03 Jun 1997 21:40:40 -0400
From: email@hidden
To: email@hidden
Subject: Re: WOMEN-IN-HOCKEY digest 589
Message-ID:
email@hidden wrote:
>
> WOMEN-IN-HOCKEY Digest 589
>
> Topics covered in this issue include:
>
> 1) Re: Women's Hockey
> by "Rich + Erin Malinowski"
> 2) Re: Help In Changing Girls Ages On Coed Teams
> by Karen A Kay
> 3) Re: Help In Changing Girls Ages On Coed Teams
> by Laurie Solgon
> 4) Visors
> by Jessica Yeo
> 5) Hockey in Boston Area
> by email@hidden (Kim Yeoh)
> 6) Re: Help In Changing Girls Ages On Coed Teams
> by Tina JW Danzig
> 7) Visors
> by Tina JW Danzig
> 8) Re: Visors
> by email@hidden
> 9) RE: Hockey at Penn State
> by "HARRIS, zharris"
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Date: Sun, 1 Jun 1997 18:26:50 -0500
> From: "Rich + Erin Malinowski"
> To:
> Subject: Re: Women's Hockey
> Message-ID:
>
> I would be willing to complete a survey for your research paper. Also,
> several members of my team have also indicated that they would help too.
> Please email me at email@hidden
>
> ----------
> > From: email@hidden
> > To: Subscribers to
> > Subject: Women's Hockey
> > Date: Sunday, May 25, 1997 4:26 PM
> >
> > I am writing a research paper about women's hockey. I have a survey that
> I
> > have written and would like to send it out. If you are interested in
> > compleating the survey please e-mail me for a copy.
> >
> > Thanks for helping in advance.
> >
> > Nicci
> > email@hidden
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Mon, 2 Jun 1997 11:22:43 -0400 (EDT)
> From: Karen A Kay
> To: email@hidden
> Cc: Multiple recipients of list
> Subject: Re: Help In Changing Girls Ages On Coed Teams
> Message-ID:
>
> I would be willing to answer your survey. Coach Karen Kay
>
> On Sun, 1 Jun 1997, Tina JW Danzig wrote:
>
> > Laurie,
> >
> > Your daughters situation sounds a lot like mine. She is usually the only
> > girl on her team. But she loves the game and it doesn't seem to borther
> > her.
> >
> > >> I've always felt that if she wants to play, she had to take what
> > comes with the game.<<
> >
> > I would normally agree with you, except for the fact that if a girl plays
> > on a girls team, the ages are different. For example, if a girls plays on
> > a coed team, Squirts are 86-87. If a girls plays on a girls team, the ages
> > are 85,86,87. They say they do this to encourage girls to play. I say, if
> > there is not a girls team for the girls to play on, then the ages should be
> > consistent with what it would be on a girls team, even if they play on a
> > coed team. They do this in Canada with no problems. Girls have been
> > playing down for years, everyone accepts this and wants it this way. Just
> > like with checking, there is no checking in Pee Wee's because they want the
> > kids to learn the fundamentals for an extra year. I agree with the
> > Canadian rules, they've been playing this game for so long, that they
> > really have it down, and know what is best for the kids. Also, if we're
> > going to be playing Canadian teams, I really feel that the rules should be
> > the same. To me, it seems logical, and not asking for special privileges.
> > I think it would accomplish what USA hockey is trying to do, and that is,
> > encouraging girls to play.
> >
> > Good luck to your daugher.
> >
> > Tina (another hockey Mom)
> >
> >
> >
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Mon, 2 Jun 1997 11:59:40 -0700 (MST)
> From: Laurie Solgon
> To: Subscribers to
> Subject: Re: Help In Changing Girls Ages On Coed Teams
> Message-ID:
>
> Thanks to Tina and all the others of you out there on this mailing list
> for supporting hockey and enlightening some of us (really me) in areas
> that we are lacking in. I was not aware of the differences in ages for
> girls playing in Canada vs the US. It gives me alot to think about in
> regards to my daughter playing. However as mentioned before, we'll need
> to change USA Hockey rules. It won't matter for my daughter, but it will
> hopefully for some other person's daughter. Let me know if there's
> anything I can do like write letters or whatever.
>
> Laurie Solgon
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> gypsy __ __ ____ ___ ___ ____
> email@hidden /__)/__) / / / / /_ /\ / /_ /
> / / \ / / / / /__ / \/ /___ /-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Mon, 2 Jun 1997 12:10:16 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Jessica Yeo
> To: email@hidden
> Subject: Visors
> Message-ID:
>
> I've been looking at visors, but I'm not sure what one to get. Which
> one
> would probably be better, the all clear, or the clear with cage at the
> bottom? Is there a specific brand that's really good? What about the
> best defogger?
> Jess Yeo
> #4
>
> _____________________________________________________________________
> Sent by RocketMail. Get your free e-mail at http://www.rocketmail.com
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Mon, 2 Jun 1997 16:25:46 -0400 (EDT)
> From: email@hidden (Kim Yeoh)
> To: email@hidden
> Subject: Hockey in Boston Area
> Message-ID:
>
> A teammate is moving to the Boston area (grad school at Tufts) this summer
> and will be looking to play either with a senior women's team, a pick-up
> group or open hockey (co-ed is okay for the latter two). If you have any
> info about what's available, she would appreciate it.
>
> Please e-mail her directly at email@hidden (Holly Mason).
> Thanks,
> Kim
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Mon, 2 Jun 1997 16:50:13 -0400
> From: Tina JW Danzig
> To: "INTERNET:email@hidden"
> Subject: Re: Help In Changing Girls Ages On Coed Teams
> Message-ID:
>
> Laurie,
>
> Thanks for the nice message. I just got off the phone with Karen Lungren
> (sp), who is head of women's hockey at USA Hockey. We had a nice
> discussion about ages of girls in hockey. She is leaving for the Congress
> tomorrow, and promises to "throw into the pot" my ideas on having the ages
> for girls playing in coed leagues be the same as for girls playing in girls
> leagues. She does not hold out much promise that anything will change, but
> at least USA Hockey will have to take a look at it. Made me feel pretty
> good that what I'm trying to accomplish will be discussed.
>
> She also told me to try to put together a girls team in our area. She said
> that just like in a Field Of Dreams, when they said, "If you build it, they
> will come." If you make it available to the young girls, a team will
> follow. I'm sure she's probably right. But, like she said, most of the
> young girls will have little to no skills, so kids like my daughter, who
> play successfully with the elite boys, will have to continue to play on a
> boys team, and also help out on the newly formed girls teams. Otherwise
> they will be too bored and fall further behind the boys. But at least it
> will bring more girls into hockey.
>
> Tina
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Mon, 2 Jun 1997 16:56:14 -0400
> From: Tina JW Danzig
> To: "INTERNET:email@hidden"
> Subject: Visors
> Message-ID:
>
> Jess,
>
> My daughter uses a cage and likes that the best. Some of the complaints
> I've heard about visors, is that they are delicate, and scratch easily.
> Also, some kids say they are very hot and heavy. I understand that they do
> have some now, that you don't need a defogger.
>
> Tina
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Mon, 2 Jun 1997 17:45:05 -0400 (EDT)
> From: email@hidden
> To: email@hidden
> Subject: Re: Visors
> Message-ID:
>
> I like clear visor with a metal cage (Itech). I feel like the cage allows me
> more unimpeded breathing and the clear visor equally unimpeded vision; a full
> cage mask sometimes slides to where a bar is right across my line of vision
> and, especially with a black cage, really messes up your view of the puck.
> Also, since Itech at least comes in two pieces bolted together, you don't
> have to replace the whole thing if one part breaks. Caveat: A clear visor
> indoors in summer (or anytime the rink air is warmer-damper than normal) or
> outdoors on a damp night tends to fog up much more quickly. If it's really
> damp, you're stuck with some fog.
>
> As for defogging, don't waste your money on sprays. Put a quarter-size drop
> of CLEAR shampoo (ie, baby shampoo) on your visor, spread it thinly with your
> finger all over the visor and wipe off all but a thin sheen with a clean
> paper towel (not tissue, leaves residue). This should last you a couple of
> games at least and is much clearer, more durable and CHEAPER than sprays.
> Occasionally, wash the whole thing off and dry well before reapplying the
> shampoo; it does hold lint and dirt in the corners.
>
> Margaret
> BBlades
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Mon, 2 Jun 97 14:02:00 -0700
> From: "HARRIS, zharris"
> To: email@hidden, email@hidden (subscribers to)
> Subject: RE: Hockey at Penn State
> Message-ID:
>
> Can anyone fill me in on the hockey scene at Penn State (club, etc.)? I
> have a friend moving there (husband will be faculty) and is looking for
> contact information.
>
> Thanks.
> Zoe
> email@hidden
>
> ------------------------------
>
> End of WOMEN-IN-HOCKEY Digest 589
> *********************************
Hello all,
I am responding to the visor question. I purchased a Cooper visor with
the cage and had fogging problems. However, the best anti-fog I found
is called FOG-X, the same company that makes the RAIN-X for car
windshields. I bought it at a hardware store in the US and have been
looking for it in Canada with no luck, so if anyone has any
suggestions....
Susanne #27
Thunder Bay Women's Hockey Association
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 3 Jun 1997 21:32:02 -0500 (CDT)
From: email@hidden
To: email@hidden
Subject: Re: Girls playing down in age.
Message-ID:
I like very much what Peggy said:
Changing the classification from age to size.
This past year I have read so much written in some of the hockey publications about all the injuries, and how many more of the really bad ones that are happening.
Most of the arguments revolve around the idea that the kids do not know how to check properly. Thus, there is a movement to lower the age for checking. Perhaps that is part of the answer. I think that Peggy's idea would help much more.
I know that for football(younger rec. leagues) and wrestling they do this.
Then, perhaps more girls would stay or join teams without the size intimidation factor added on. Especially in areas that do not have girls teams.
With my daughter, who played this past year as the only girl on a Squirt Travel "A" team, the size factor is definately taking a toll. She will be going to Pee Wee in the fall and she is very aprehensive about the playing(checking) in that age group. She is not a small girl, and she has always been able to handle herself on the ice. But now the sizes of the players are really starting to range dramatically. And, of course, there is me. I don't want her to get hurt like you read about in the articles. But, she deserves to be able to play the game, the same as the boys, as an equal, not special.
Sorry about the soapbox.
Samdy.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 3 Jun 1997 23:09:55 -0400 (EDT)
From: email@hidden
To: email@hidden
Subject: Re: WOMEN-IN-HOCKEY digest 575
Message-ID:
I clipped it. E-mail your address or fax number and I'll send you a copy.
It was great!
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 4 Jun 1997 01:36:36 -0400
From: Tina JW Danzig
To: "INTERNET:email@hidden"
Subject: Re[2]: Help In Changing Girls Ages On Coed Teams
Message-ID:
Kellie,
>>NARCH and KOHO are roller hockey teams....that has nothing to do with Ice
hockey ages.<,
Thanks for the clarification. I thought I must be missing something big if
it pertained to ice hockey.
Good luck on your new team, I'm sure you'll do well.
Tina
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 4 Jun 1997 11:11:25 -0400 (EDT)
From: email@hidden
To: email@hidden
Subject: Re: Help in Changing Girls Ages....
Message-ID:
I have been playing hockey for 8 years and I am now 15. I have always played
with the boys and I feel that if we argue about the age then we r just going
to start losing support towards womens hockey. I think that girls should
play at their own age group because more than likely if they r teenagers they
will be bigger then the boys anyway. I am 5ft9 and am the tallest on my boys
team by far except for one player is taller than me but he is a senior in
high school. I dont know how everyone else feels and u might totally
disagree with me but i just dont want womens hockey to lose support because
we cant play in our own age group. Capice?
Becky #19
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 4 Jun 1997 12:21:39 -0400
From: "Lynn Witkowski"
To:
Subject: Re: Help in Changing Girls Ages....
Message-ID:
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
------=_NextPart_000_01BC70E1.DA891260
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
----------
> From: email@hidden
> I have been playing hockey for 8 years and I am now 15. I have always
played
> with the boys and I feel that if we argue about the age then we r just
going
> to start losing support towards womens hockey. I think that girls should
> play at their own age group because more than likely if they r teenagers
they
> will be bigger then the boys anyway. I am 5ft9 and am the tallest on my
boys
> team by far except for one player is taller than me but he is a senior in
> high school. I dont know how everyone else feels and u might totally
> disagree with me but i just dont want womens hockey to lose support
because
> we cant play in our own age group. Capice?
> Becky #19
I think Becky makes a good point.
I don't think making teams based on size is a workable solution either.
There are kids who are small and quite adept at hockey who wouldn't be
happy playing with kids their own size. The age difference would really
matter. And making a big 10 or 11 year old play with 14 or 15 year olds
just wouldn't be wise. Just moving kids up one category in age makes a
difference with the peer influence of that age group. Take a 15 year old
girl and have her play on a team of 16 and 17 year olds... The older kids
drive, and drink and do whatever... It just would not be in the best
interest of the younger girl.
------=_NextPart_000_01BC70E1.DA891260
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
----------
> From: email@hidden
> I =
have been playing hockey for 8 years and I am now 15. I have =
always played
> with the boys and I feel that if we argue about =
the age then we r just going
> to start losing support towards =
womens hockey. I think that girls should
> play at their own =
age group because more than likely if they r teenagers they
> will =
be bigger then the boys anyway. I am 5ft9 and am the tallest on my =
boys
> team by far except for one player is taller than me but he =
is a senior in
> high school. I dont know how everyone else =
feels and u might totally
> disagree with me but i just dont want =
womens hockey to lose support because
> we cant play in our own =
age group. Capice?
> Becky #19
I think Becky makes a =
good point.
I don't think making teams based on size is a =
workable solution either. There are kids who are small and quite adept =
at hockey who wouldn't be happy playing with kids their own size. The =
age difference would really matter. And making a big 10 or 11 year old =
play with 14 or 15 year olds just wouldn't be wise. Just moving kids up =
one category in age makes a difference with the peer influence of that =
age group. Take a 15 year old girl and have her play on a team of 16 and =
17 year olds... The older kids drive, and drink and do whatever... It =
just would not be in the best interest of the younger girl.
------=_NextPart_000_01BC70E1.DA891260--
------------------------------
End of WOMEN-IN-HOCKEY Digest 591
*********************************