Parent
WOMEN-IN-HOCKEY Digest 542
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) RE: mud wrestling vs. checking
by "Ken Luk"
2) Virus alert
by Edward N Saunders
3) Re: Virus alert
by email@hidden (Stormwind)
4) Re: Virus alert
by email@hidden
5) Re: Virus alert
by Chuq Von Rospach
6) Re: Cammi Granato
by Lea Sanford
7) Re: rules
by Lea Sanford
8) Re: Body Checking
by email@hidden (DAVE BAKER)
9) Re: Gretzky & Messier
by email@hidden (Lyle Anderson)
10) Re: Gretzky & Messier
by Chuq Von Rospach
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Date: Fri, 18 Apr 97 23:36:40 +0400
From: "Ken Luk"
To: "email@hidden"
Subject: RE: mud wrestling vs. checking
Message-ID:
On Fri, 18 Apr 1997 06:17:59 -0700, Mary Wood wrote:
>Our team's experience at Brampton was quite the opposite of yours, there was alot of physical and body contact allowed during all of our games, much more so than we were used to getting away with. Penalties which were called, on both sides, had to do for the most part with illegal stick contact. So as long as our sticks were down and we were going for the puck, we were allowed alot of body contact.
>
>Mary Wood
>Chesapeake Bay Lightning
Hi Mary!
I officiated one of your games in Brampton. Don't ask me which, because
they all seem to blend together. My preference is not to call body
checking penalties if both players are going after the puck. All that
contact, in my view, is incidental. I do, however, do a lot of talking
to the players when they do come together and warn them about
deliberate contact and sticks being carried too high.
Ken
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Date: Fri, 18 Apr 1997 23:34:36 -0400 (EDT)
From: Edward N Saunders
To: email@hidden
Subject: Virus alert
Message-ID:
Because a few of you have decided to get so upset over my fair warning, I
am going to make a statement.
As a member of the marketing staff for UNH Women's hockey, which is why you
received not only this message but the warning. We here at UNH put a
great deal of time into researching the future of your sport.
If you are so self absorbed to spend time complaining of my attempt to
warn you of a potential threat, than I suggest you leave the list for you
obviously misunderstand the solidarity spirit surrounding women's hockey.
Regardless of hoaxes, I am simply trying to assist you. That is all. I
find it offensive that a simple warning, from one of the most highly
respected sports marketing researchers in the world none the less, is
taken as a waste of time.
While you may frown upon academics, it is we, through Title IX and other
methods, who have fought for your cause harder than any others.
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 18 Apr 1997 22:55:36 -0700
From: email@hidden (Stormwind)
To: email@hidden
Subject: Re: Virus alert
Message-ID:
Ed Saunders writes:
As a member of the marketing staff for UNH Women's hockey, which is why you
received not only this message but the warning. We here at UNH put a
great deal of time into researching the future of your sport.
what on earth does researching the future
of women's hockey have to do with perpetuating
a potential hoax/urban legend?
If you are so self absorbed to spend time complaining of my attempt to
warn you of a potential threat, than I suggest you leave the list for you
obviously misunderstand the solidarity spirit surrounding women's hockey.
i *continually* educate people as to the
truth behind known hoaxes/urban legends
in an effort to keep the ignorant from
spazzing out everyone. the "horrible
virus in your email" theme is one of the
oldest known computer urban legends known,
and is second only to variations involving
good old craig shergold. check out
alt.folklore.urban-legends, look for the
FAQ, and you'll see what i mean.
Regardless of hoaxes, I am simply trying to assist you. That is all. I
find it offensive that a simple warning, from one of the most highly
respected sports marketing researchers in the world none the less, is
taken as a waste of time.
do you work for CERT, or one of the other
computer alert agencies that research
security holes and attacks? that is THE
only authority which i will take seriously
about "virus alerts". i still fail to see
what sports marketing has to do with researching
the validity of an email virus.
ob. women's hockey: i have succeeded in
converting yet another co-worker into hockey!
first her housemate introduced her to hockey
on tv, and then to the local sharks games.
next, we took her skating during public skate...
she's VERY good, due to many years spent on skis.
and now she's going to check out this weekend's
"give hockey a try" clinic put on by the norcal
women's hockey league.
now, i have to confess, the fact that she went
from skis to skates SO easily (she was skating
backwards just fine on her first outing) just
kills me. she claims you use ski edges just as
much as skate edges...never having skiied, i have
no concept of using ski edges. right now, she's
skating better than her housemate, who plays roller
and ice hockey...and she has a better attitude, too.
her housemate, who is male, will skate at public
skate but doesn't want to work on much other
than just plain old skating. but she works on
crossovers, front/back reversals, stops, the
whole nine yards. and she's got a following of
other hockey players who step in when i take a
break and work with her on technique!
never discount the value of a public skate for
working on technique. practices are for getting
used to puckhandling and shooting...public skate
is for the rest of the stuff.
stormwind
hell's amazon
lord of the frozen realm
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Date: Sat, 19 Apr 1997 08:53:49 -0400 (EDT)
From: email@hidden
To: email@hidden
Subject: Re: Virus alert
Message-ID:
I'm certainly not complaining...but there have been a lot of "killer virus"
rumors floating around. And usually word of them comes from a friend of a
friend. I hope the rumors isn't true, but if it is, thanks for the warning.
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 19 Apr 1997 08:45:54 -0700
From: Chuq Von Rospach
To: email@hidden
Subject: Re: Virus alert
Message-ID:
At 8:40 PM -0700 4/18/97, Edward N Saunders wrote:
>Because a few of you have decided to get so upset over my fair warning, I
>am going to make a statement.
Okay, and since he feels like making a statement, as owner of this
list, I'll make on in return.
I have told Edward privately that (a) he broke the list rules, and (b)
not to do it again. This is a hockey list, and the rules specifically
say NOT to post things like this to it.
As I told him, if you don't understand *why* this rule exists, go try
to talk hockey on a computer virus list and see how far you get. There
are appropriate topics for lists, and you stick with them.
The ONLY reason I'm not doing my normal, which is kick the person who
posts things like this to the list, is that unlike 99.9% of the other
"virus warnings" that happen to be posted by well-meaning people, this
one happens to be true. So he gets some slack for at least not posting
one of the dozens of hoax messages that are floating on the list.
On the other hand, the arrogance he put into THIS message makes me want
to rethink this slack. But I won't.
>If you are so self absorbed to spend time complaining of my attempt to
>warn you of a potential threat, than I suggest you leave the list for you
>obviously misunderstand the solidarity spirit surrounding women's hockey.
I suggest if ytou are so self-absorbed that you feel you're above the
rules of the list and that you don't allow others to disagree with you,
then you better rethink your attitudes. I also don't happen to
appreciate you thinking you can set list policy for me.
>While you may frown upon academics, it is we, through Title IX and other
>methods, who have fought for your cause harder than any others.
What a bogus argument. We frown about people who can't follow rules and
then get snotty about it when someone calls them on it,. Edward. Sorry.
List Mom
--
Chuq Von Rospach (email@hidden) Apple IS&T Mail List Gnome
Plaidworks Consulting (email@hidden)
( +-+ The home for Hockey on the net)
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Date: Sat, 19 Apr 1997 11:52:58 -0500
From: Lea Sanford
To: email@hidden
Subject: Re: Cammi Granato
Message-ID:
> >Please do not take this the wrong way, but how often do normal people with no
> >connections to the NHL, IHL or AHL get to skate with a former or current
> >professional player? If you have, more power to you, and can you let me know
> >where I can go to skate with a pro?
Even in Houston, there are ex-pros who skate in the mens AA league.
Lea
--
email@hidden
*******************
"Forget conventionalisms; forget what the world will say, whether you
are in your place or out of your place; think your best thoughts, speak
your best words, do your best works, looking [only] to you own
conscience for approval."
--Susan B. Anthony, 1863
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Date: Sat, 19 Apr 1997 12:02:45 -0500
From: Lea Sanford
To: email@hidden
Subject: Re: rules
Message-ID:
With regard to sports which have different rules for men and womem:
Women golfers have a different tee.
Women's volleyball has a different net height.
Women's basketball (WNBA) has a different shot-clock, different period
lengths and a different three- point line.
While we are on this subject, I want to clarify that there are two very
different groups involved - the upper level NCAA and international play,
and the recreational play. Regardless of what happens in the upper
levels, I don't ever want to play full-body-check-hockey. But that is
ok, even very few of the rec men's leagues (at least in Houston) play
it.
. . . .and when you start talking about how recreational sports (men's
and women's) are different from their pro counterparts, the list is VERY
long. What I have found is that men's recreational and women's
recreational (particularly at the lowest levels) sports actually
resemble each other a great deal.
Lea
--
email@hidden
*******************
"Forget conventionalisms; forget what the world will say, whether you
are in your place or out of your place; think your best thoughts, speak
your best words, do your best works, looking [only] to you own
conscience for approval."
--Susan B. Anthony, 1863
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 19 Apr 1997 13:00:00 +0000
From: email@hidden (DAVE BAKER)
To: email@hidden
Subject: Re: Body Checking
Message-ID:
> Was not the 1990 World Championships full contact?
I spoke to our Manager, Female Programs and she tells me that it was
not full contact. Although, had you been there, you would never know
the no checking rule was in effect!!!!
Body Checking was eliminated in Women's hockey in 1986.
David Baker
Manager, Officiating
CANADIAN HOCKEY
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 19 Apr 1997 12:16:04 -0800
From: email@hidden (Lyle Anderson)
To: email@hidden
Subject: Re: Gretzky & Messier
Message-ID:
As beau coup bucks in sports disgusts me (yes, I watch anyway), I ignore
salary debates. But this post has piqued my interest. It amazes me
that Kariya and Sellanne got so much hype a couple years back, while Joe
Sakic was, to many, mostly an unknown (arguable, as Selanne was a big
time rookie with Winnepeg). That changed when the Nordiques made an
outstanding run towards The Cup in their final year in Quebec. It got
better when they won it in CO. Ironically, the guy who could have
helped Quebec bring home a Cup and possibly prevent the move to CO, did
the "Elway Whine" and now makes the big bucks playing for the Flyers.
Why do we ignore big talent when the player is on a weak team in the
East and pony up our big bucks and shout "go Teemu, go Paul" when the
players are on a weak team in the West? Marketing!?
How does this apply to Women's Hockey? I suspect that we will stand in
awe of the women and teams that are statistically accomplished after
Nagano. I also suspect that as hype over the new medal sport expands,
we will allow the accomplished women from before the medal to go
unnoticed. Sadly, these will also be the women who persevered and broke
the barriers that prevented Women's hockey from becoming mainstream
sooner.
It is likely that the days of Women's Pro Hockey are still far away. It
would behoove us to assure that we preserve the memory of those that led
the way. What's more we should also remember to recognize the
accomplishments of the "marquee quality" players that don't play on the
winningest and best marketed teams. A Women's Hockey Hall of Fame would
do nicely (is there one already?).
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 19 Apr 1997 15:41:31 -0700
From: Chuq Von Rospach
To: email@hidden
Subject: Re: Gretzky & Messier
Message-ID:
At 1:19 PM -0700 4/19/97, Lyle Anderson wrote:
>Why do we ignore big talent when the player is on a weak team in the
>East and pony up our big bucks and shout "go Teemu, go Paul" when the
>players are on a weak team in the West? Marketing!?
Media -- compare the newspaper/tv/radio coverage in Quebec City and
Montreal. Joe Sakic in Quebec City just doesn't get much visibility.
Joe Sakic in Denver does. Joe Sakic in New York City, however, does
even better (no, I'm not predicting)
Point of information -- The Sahrks came in second in the Gretzky races
to the Rangers. It's been admitted by both sides that the Sharks
contract offer for Wayne was higher than the Rangers, but that
endorsement money for Gretzky in NYC was enough more to swing the deal
to the Rangers advantage. And San Jose (as part of the greater Bay
Area) is the 4th or 5th largest media market in the country, so it's
not like we were sending him to Des Moines, or even Dallas....
>I also suspect that as hype over the new medal sport expands,
>we will allow the accomplished women from before the medal to go
>unnoticed. Sadly, these will also be the women who persevered and broke
>the barriers that prevented Women's hockey from becoming mainstream
>sooner.
It depends. And even in th "glamour" sports of the Olympics whether
they can do anything endorsement-wise it's far from a given. Ask Nancy
Kerrigan. You never know who's going to become the media darlings. And
honestly, I'm not sure endorsement contracts or Wheaties boxes are the
way to judge success, anyway.
>It is likely that the days of Women's Pro Hockey are still far away.
Probably, but if you want it, go support the ABL and the other women's
basketball leagues. If those succeed, it'll be easier to convince
people about the viability of women's sports. If they don't, they'll be
used as excuses to simply not try.
--
Chuq Von Rospach (email@hidden) Apple IS&T Mail List Gnome
Plaidworks Consulting (email@hidden)
( +-+ The home for Hockey on the net)
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End of WOMEN-IN-HOCKEY Digest 542
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