Parent
WOMEN-IN-HOCKEY Digest 341
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) RE: More real hockey news
by J and S blank
2) RE: More real hockey news
by email@hidden (Dark Phoenix)
3) RE: More hockey news
by Michele D Ryan
4) Re: can't get no respect. . .
by Jan de Regt
5) Re: More real hockey news
by email@hidden (Kristen M. Ede)
6) Re: More real hockey news
by Jan de Regt
7) Women's hockey in Denver?
by "HEIDI K HEFFERNAN"
8) Re: More real hockey news
by Karen A Robinson
9) Re: More real hockey news
by Laurie Sefton
10) Massachusetts/South Shore Womens Hockey
by email@hidden
11) Re: More real hockey news
by Lyssa
12) Speaking up
by melissa
13) RE: Massachusetts/South Shore Womens Hockey
by "Ashmun, Julia D"
14) Re: listing a girls midget team in plattsburgh,n.y.
by corey rosoff
15) Re: new teams formed
by corey rosoff
16) Re: Women's hockey in Denver?
by Rhonda Paprocki
17) Re: Massachusetts/South Shore Womens Hockey
by Rhonda Paprocki
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 7 Oct 1996 00:21:40 -0500
From: J and S blank
To: "'email@hidden'"
Subject: RE: More real hockey news
Message-ID:
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Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
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Regarding the following:
>>>I think that there should be more real hockey news and less =
complaints. Almost all the mail I have recived have been complaints. =
This just makes it look like nobody is interested in hockey, only =
complaining. I play hockey and would like to hear more about the sport =
not the femanist movment.
Mary Mitchell<<<
I disagree. I found the topics referred to as "complaining" to be as =
relevant to Women-in-Hockey as the talk of achievements made in the =
sport or any logistics and statistics.
I like that someone has asked for help to remind a few hockey sponsors =
that women's hockey deserves more respect and not a beer-commercial-like =
parody taking its place.
I find it incredible that in this day and age, with women's hockey =
becoming an Olympic exhibition sport, that anyone would bother with a =
tiara-and-cocktail-dress costumed bunch of women who can't even skate. =20
I suppose it was a misguided attempt to appeal to the demographic the =
sponsors assume to be the main supporters of the sport: Men, ages =
18-Whatever. Just shows how out of touch they are.
And I thought the discussion about the Motley Crue song to also be =
relevant. Again, it shows another group who didn't do their homework =
and find out the pertinent information.
I found the topics to be more than mere "complaining." They were =
discussions that touched on problems women in sports still face, and the =
writers were looking for solutions to the problems. =20
On a Women-In-Hockey list, anything that relates to the subject should =
be discussed, and I'm a little bothered that anyone might try to squelch =
what others might want to talk about.
(I won't even address the irony of complaining about the feminist =
movement...)
Best,
~Sue
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Date: Mon, 7 Oct 1996 01:58:04 -0400
From: email@hidden (Dark Phoenix)
To: email@hidden
Subject: RE: More real hockey news
Message-ID:
>Regarding the following:
>
>>>>I think that there should be more real hockey news and less complaints.
>>>>Almost all the mail I have recived have been complaints. This just
>>>>makes it look like nobody is interested in hockey, only complaining. I
>>>>play hockey and would like to hear more about the sport not the
>>>>femanist movment.
>
> Mary Mitchell<<<
>
>I disagree. I found the topics referred to as "complaining" to be as
>relevant to Women-in-Hockey as the talk of achievements made in the sport
>or any logistics and statistics.
[...]
>I found the topics to be more than mere "complaining." They were
>discussions that touched on problems women in sports still face, and the
>writers were looking for solutions to the problems.
>
>On a Women-In-Hockey list, anything that relates to the subject should be
>discussed, and I'm a little bothered that anyone might try to squelch what
>others might want to talk about.
>
>(I won't even address the irony of complaining about the feminist movement...)
Hear, hear!
Mary, if you don't like what you're reading on the Women In Hockey list,
*then write some news of your own*! But obviously, there are people here
for whom these discussions are pertinent. And talk about someone
complaining about other people complaining....
-- Ali.
Ali Lemer -=- ali at panix dot com -=-=- http://www.panix.com/~ali-=-
"I am the atomic-powered robot. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Please give my best wishes to everybody!" -- Minsky -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 7 Oct 1996 02:05:43 -0700 (PDT)
From: Michele D Ryan
To: Women in Hockey
Subject: RE: More hockey news
Message-ID:
Mary wrote:
>I think that there should be more real hockey news and less complaints.
>Almost all the mail I have recived have been complaints. This just makes it
>look like nobody is interested in hockey, only complaining. I play hockey
>and would like to hear more about the sport not the femanist movment.
Uh, how long have you been a subscriber? I've been here almost a year,
and this is one of the few times I can remember that the subject of
perceptions about female players has come up. Clearly, a number of us
are concerned & want to discuss it. You can always skip messages that don't
interest you.
--Michele
------------------------------
Date: 07 Oct 1996 10:09:12 -0400
From: Jan de Regt
To: "email@hidden" (Return requested) (Receipt notification requested),
Subject: Re: can't get no respect. . .
Lea -
Can you give me a way to contact you that I can send to slimeball
McCall? I've written a letter, and following the lead of another
women on this list and fellow Chesapeake Bay Lightning, I have
suggested that a good start on reparations would be for his dealership
to sponsor you for jerseys and socks.
So, how can he contact you?
Thanks,
Jan.
______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________
Subject: can't get no respect. . .
Author: email@hidden at Internet
Date: 10/4/96 1:51 AM
Since we are on the subject of society (or the media) not respecting
wonen hockey players. . . . .
On September 21, the Red Wings and the Penguins faced off in Houston for
and exhbition game. We have IHL hockey, but seldome get NHL here. A
local car dealership, Sterling McCall Toyota, sponsored the event (as in
their name was plastered ALL over it). The second intermission featured
a "women's hockey game" played between the Miller Lite Billboard Girls
who were wearing (translated -- falling out of) black cocktail dresses
and tiarras. To really top things off, they couldn't skate.
I really took this bad. We are just now getting one hour of women's
only ice here a week. We are working hard to get a *very recreational*
team together for the tournament in Las Vegas in February. So far, we
can't get a sponsor for jearsys/socks. In general, male hockey players
here are very good about playing with women, but the girls playing here
(on boys teams) take alot of trash.
I wrote a letter to Mr. Sterling McCall outlining the fact that over 50%
of the IHL season ticket holders here are women and that he had poorly
chosen enternainment for that particular demographic. I also outlined
the fact that the event was hailed as *family entertainment* but hardly
qualified as such.
I didn't hear from Mr. McCall, but he had his marketing company call me
and tell me that it wasn't his (Mr. McCall's) fault. The guy actually
thought that the fact that he had *helped bring NHL hockey to Houston*
made demeaning women OK. Apparently, a very crude local radio station
had participated as a *media partner* and got to design that slot
(making this clearly not his problem). In the end, he said that he
might try to use the women's program in next year's promotional, but he
really didn't come off as all that sincere.
This guy seemed to think that I was an isolated *problem* and kept
saying that he just wasn't familliar with women's hockey. I thought I
would give you his name and info so anyone wanting to help educate him
on just how popular the game is could contact him or his employer.
Sterling Mc Call Toyota
http://www.sterlingmccalltoyota.com/index.html
Thomal Hensey
Rhino Marketing
713-526-4426
(sorry I can't find e-mail on him)
Boy, I am glad I got that off my chest!
Peace, Love, and Understanding,
Lea
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 7 Oct 1996 10:57:47 -0400
From: email@hidden (Kristen M. Ede)
To: email@hidden
Subject: Re: More real hockey news
Message-ID:
>I think that there should be more real hockey news and less complaints.
>Almost all the mail I have recived have been complaints. This just makes it
>look like nobody is interested in hockey, only complaining. I play hockey
>and would like to hear more about the sport not the femanist movment.
>
> Mary Mitchell
>
Feminist Movement? Speaking out against people that are demeaning the sport
of women's hockey is part of the feminist movement??? Get with the times
Mary...
I commend Lea and the others for taking a stance and instead of just
*complaining* about it, taking action against it.
Thanks Robert for the addresses..My letters will be in the mail today..
Kristen
------------------------------
Date: 07 Oct 1996 10:56:04 -0400
From: Jan de Regt
To: "email@hidden" (Return requested),
Subject: Re: More real hockey news
In some instances, the sport can not continue to grow and prosper
without action from those of us who, like you, play the sport and love
it. If we weren't interested in women's hockey, why would we care
when someone makes a stupid parady of women's ice hockey in front of
tens of thousands of hockey fans?!
This is the first thread of this sort that I can remember. As with
any thread, if your're not interested don't read it.
______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________
Subject: More real hockey news
Author: email@hidden at Internet
Date: 10/6/96 10:45 PM
I think that there should be more real hockey news and less complaints.
Almost all the mail I have recived have been complaints. This just makes it
look like nobody is interested in hockey, only complaining. I play hockey
and would like to hear more about the sport not the femanist movment.
Mary Mitchell
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 7 Oct 1996 09:23:42 -0700
From: "HEIDI K HEFFERNAN"
To: email@hidden
Subject: Women's hockey in Denver?
Message-ID:
I was wondering if anyone could tell me if they have information about
women's hockey in Colorado. I just moved to Denver and would like to
continue playing but I don't know who to contact out here. Any
information would be appreciated.
Thanks,
Heidi Heffernan
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 7 Oct 1996 13:02:11 -0400 (EDT)
From: Karen A Robinson
To: Multiple recipients of list
Subject: Re: More real hockey news
Message-ID:
On Sun, 6 Oct 1996, Mary Mitchell wrote:
> I think that there should be more real hockey news and less complaints.
> Almost all the mail I have recived have been complaints. This just makes it
> look like nobody is interested in hockey, only complaining. I play hockey
> and would like to hear more about the sport not the femanist movment.
To think that a discussion on how the sport of women's hockey is perceived
and presented is about "the feminist movement" and not about the sport is
narrow, at best. How the sport is presented influences the sport itself.
The perceived prestige or validity of the sport dictates aspects such as
the ice time provided (amount and hours of day), media coverage of *real*
women's hockey games, quality of coaches, etc.
Mary, I do not understand how you can say that people discussing and
acting on this issue indicates a lack of interest in hockey.
Karen
email@hidden
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 7 Oct 1996 10:19:37 -0700
From: Laurie Sefton
To: email@hidden
Subject: Re: More real hockey news
Message-ID:
re: "Mary Mitchell" complains about what's being discussed on this list:
Mary, you're not running this list. I am. If someone decides that a topic
is inappropriate, it will be me. Read the FAQ--it's all in there.
This *is* an appropriate topic to this list. For those of us who weren't
allowed to play in the boys leagues (and no one felt it was in their
interest to have girls leagues), having some ignorant fool make light of
everything we've accomplished in the last 30 years harkens back to the "bad
old days" when girls and women weren't supposed to play "real" sports, or
if they did, were considered part of the local freak show.
Guess what? I don't want to go back there, and I'll be damned if some girl
gets the idea that she's not supposed to play hockey because of what some
uninformed dolts find amusing.
And I've had mothers bring their daughters over to me after a practice,
after the pads and the helmet came off, and they saw it was a woman who had
been out there on the ice, and I told them all--"yeah, girls can play
hockey!"
And I'm proud to call myself a feminist.
Laurie
**********
email@hidden
"All the best defencemen have goalie eyes."
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 7 Oct 1996 13:25:37 -0400
From: email@hidden
To: email@hidden
Subject: Massachusetts/South Shore Womens Hockey
Message-ID:
Looking for a senior B level team. Does anyone have any info?
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 7 Oct 1996 14:05:45 -0400
From: Lyssa
To: email@hidden
Subject: Re: More real hockey news
Message-ID:
>I think that there should be more real hockey news and less complaints.
>Almost all the mail I have recived have been complaints. This just makes it
>look like nobody is interested in hockey, only complaining. I play hockey
>and would like to hear more about the sport not the femanist movment.
>
> Mary Mitchell
Mary,
I don't think that we've been discussing the feminist movement. I think
we've just been clearly stating the obvious lack of respect that women's
hockey programs have been recieving. It would appear to me that few people
outside of the sport know that women's hockey has been around for over 100
years. I if that in itself doesn't demand respect, what does????? Just
some food for thought!
Love,
Lyssa
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 7 Oct 96 12:09:33 -0700
From: melissa
To:
Subject: Speaking up
Message-ID:
Hi, everyone!
I took Lea's note about the women-in-ballgowns hockey to heart. These
kinds of exhibitions make it more difficult for women in ALL sports to
get the respect they deserve.
I've included the story in the "No Go" section of the recent issue of
Go,girl! Magazine in the hopes that our readers will share our
displeasure and write to the people who were responsible for sponsoring
this event.
I intend to write some letters of my own, as well.
It's important that we all speak up when situations like this one arise;
unfortunately, it's become our responsibility as women athletes (and the
people who support women athletes) to educate the media, society, and
other athletes that we play REAL sports, and deserve REAL respect.
All the best,
Melissa
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
Melissa Joulwan
Step By Step Fitness/Go, girl! Magazine
415-332-4134
http://www.gogirlmag.com -- Go,girl! is a bi-weekly magazine dedicated to
getting women of all ages and abilities involved in sports.
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
"If God invented marathons to keep people from doing anything more
stupid, triathlon must have taken Him completely by surprise."
-- P.Z. Pearce, M.D.
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 07 Oct 96 16:33:00 EDT
From: "Ashmun, Julia D"
To: women-in-hockey
Subject: RE: Massachusetts/South Shore Womens Hockey
Message-ID:
Send your fax number and I'll send you a list of the teams and levels.
email@hidden
----------
From: women-in-hockey
To: Subscribers to
Subject: Massachusetts/South Shore Womens Hockey
Date: Monday, October 07, 1996 10:31AM
Looking for a senior B level team. Does anyone have any info?
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 13:05:31 +0000
From: corey rosoff
To: email@hidden
Subject: Re: listing a girls midget team in plattsburgh,n.y.
Message-ID:
corey rosoff wrote:
>
> plattsburgh youth hockey now has 2 girls midget teams. one an a-b
> caliber, and the other a beginner team. we play our games at the crete
> center in plattsburgh,n.y.our season runs from october until march. our
> team contact is cazzi rosoff who can be reached at e-mail adress of
> email@hidden
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 13:04:02 +0000
From: corey rosoff
To: email@hidden
Subject: Re: new teams formed
Message-ID:
corey rosoff wrote:
>
> plattsburgh youth hockey now has 2 teams in woman's hockey. one is a
> midget b team. if any team in northern vermont,new york or montreal is
> intersted in scheduling games please e-mail us at email@hidden .
> our home sheet of ice is sunday's at 11:45 at the crete civic center.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 8 Oct 1996 02:06:32 GMT
From: Rhonda Paprocki
To: email@hidden
Subject: Re: Women's hockey in Denver?
Message-ID:
At 08:34 AM 10/7/96 -0700, you wrote:
>I was wondering if anyone could tell me if they have information about
>women's hockey in Colorado. I just moved to Denver and would like to
>continue playing but I don't know who to contact out here. Any
>information would be appreciated.
>
>Thanks,
>Heidi Heffernan
>
Try contacting Cathy Crum (970) 925-4954 of the Aspen Mother Puckers or
Carley Gossmeyer of Colorado College (719)389-6476. They should have a contact
number for the denver team (I don't have info on that team).
This is from : http://www.cs.utoronto.ca/~andria/Team_List.html
Good luck
Rhonda Paprocki
email@hidden
"The race is not always to the swift....
but to those who keep on running."
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 8 Oct 1996 02:07:56 GMT
From: Rhonda Paprocki
To: email@hidden
Subject: Re: Massachusetts/South Shore Womens Hockey
Message-ID:
At 10:31 AM 10/7/96 -0700, you wrote:
>Looking for a senior B level team. Does anyone have any info?
After you get the info, ask if there are any contacts for the league
who are willing to be named on the web page. This would help other
people contact them too.
Thanks
Rhonda Paprocki
email@hidden
"The race is not always to the swift....
but to those who keep on running."
------------------------------
End of WOMEN-IN-HOCKEY Digest 341
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